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I am really confused as to why the security community is obsessed with the term "nation state". Every single publication or quote from security researchers that

by ddod 12y ago

I am really confused as to why the security community is obsessed with the term "nation state". Every single publication or quote from security researchers that wants to attribute some worm or attack to a country incorrectly calls it a nation state. A nation state is a specific thing that is not just a pompous way of saying state or country. If you're wondering, you can check the Wikipedia entry on it. There's nothing inherent about any type of technical attack that could connect to a nation state. It's sort of a shibboleth of someone who is self-important and doesn't fact-check.

deleted 12y ago
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sighsigh 12y ago
What's even more problematic is that you have been downvoted on a community that was founded by people who participated in building the tech responsible for forging history's first self-sustaining post-nationalist identity (the internet) in history. The nation-state must be the enemy, which can only be defeated by a nation-state... because the concept of a nation-state is dying and is engaging in full blown Hegelian dialectics to keep itself afloat. Unions, nationalists, and identity zealots have been having a field day with HackerNews as of late.
- wcummings 12y ago
  >history's first self-sustaining post-nationalist identity (the internet) What do you mean by this?
  - sighsigh 12y ago
    It means the internet allows people to communicate, share ideas, and form cultural bonds and identities outside of the highly-restricted context of national frameworks.
- deleted 12y ago
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- gizmo686 12y ago
  >history's first self-sustaining post-nationalist identity I am not a historian, but wouldn't that honor go to religion? Regardless, religion is certainly older than the Internet.
  - sighsigh 12y ago
    This is technically correct in concept, but not in practice, as organized religion existed long before the formalization of the nation-state. In fact, one can even argue that nationalism is an agnostic subdivision of organized theology since it utilizes identical symbol worship mechanisms.
TheSpiceIsLife 12y ago
I'd put it down to the aesthetics of common usage. 'Nation state' looks and sounds better than the alternatives. Words mean whatever their users intend them to mean regardless of whether the usage is technically, or historically, incorrect. Edit: a word
lazaroclapp 12y ago
Wouldn't the definition then mean that you should say "state" or "state actor"? To attribute a worm or attack to a country would only mean that it originated there, not that it was created by the well-resourced state organization that is associated with that country (which is what the people using the "nation-state" label seek to imply).

by ddod 12y ago

deleted 12y ago

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sighsigh 12y ago

What's even more problematic is that you have been downvoted on a community that was founded by people who participated in building the tech responsible for forging history's first self-sustaining post-nationalist identity (the internet) in history. The nation-state must be the enemy, which can only be defeated by a nation-state... because the concept of a nation-state is dying and is engaging in full blown Hegelian dialectics to keep itself afloat. Unions, nationalists, and identity zealots have been having a field day with HackerNews as of late.

wcummings 12y ago
>history's first self-sustaining post-nationalist identity (the internet) What do you mean by this?
- sighsigh 12y ago
  It means the internet allows people to communicate, share ideas, and form cultural bonds and identities outside of the highly-restricted context of national frameworks.
deleted 12y ago
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gizmo686 12y ago
>history's first self-sustaining post-nationalist identity I am not a historian, but wouldn't that honor go to religion? Regardless, religion is certainly older than the Internet.
- sighsigh 12y ago
  This is technically correct in concept, but not in practice, as organized religion existed long before the formalization of the nation-state. In fact, one can even argue that nationalism is an agnostic subdivision of organized theology since it utilizes identical symbol worship mechanisms.

TheSpiceIsLife 12y ago

I'd put it down to the aesthetics of common usage. 'Nation state' looks and sounds better than the alternatives. Words mean whatever their users intend them to mean regardless of whether the usage is technically, or historically, incorrect. Edit: a word

lazaroclapp 12y ago

Wouldn't the definition then mean that you should say "state" or "state actor"? To attribute a worm or attack to a country would only mean that it originated there, not that it was created by the well-resourced state organization that is associated with that country (which is what the people using the "nation-state" label seek to imply).