I am just a bit concerned with a few of your assumptions here. Maybe you are right, but my experience has been so different I have to point a few things out. I

I am just a bit concerned with a few of your assumptions here. Maybe you are right, but my experience has been so different I have to point a few things out. In the software business we are all "refactor guys" as you put it. The old adage goes "as an engineer, I have never found a code base I liked". I understand there are best practices that are really helpful. I am a huge believer in TDD, paired programming, DevOps, and other extreme programming principles. But I have never been in an organization that had the zeal that I do for these things. Every code base I have worked on (including code bases I completely wrote on my own) has needed refactoring. Some, most, on a constant basis. I hate to admit, but the minority of engineers who write code correctly the first time is so low, you will not run into them very often in your career. [1] I hope you find them. Personally I have become quite happy with refactoring poor code, even when those who did not write it correctly the first time do not appreciate nor learn from my efforts. As for your comment about your first job, I think you will find that there are a few engineers who have many many years of experience. However, you will find many more engineers who have one year of experience repeated over and over again. They may have 10 years on paper, but in reality they have about 1 years worth of experience. How you learn to correct them and help the organization who pays your check will be the deciding factor in your future financial success. You are at the precipice of a hugely successful career! Don't get too stressed by poor engineering groups, because you will run into them regularly. It really seems like you have made up your mind to move on. Frankly, that's not a bad decision at all! Just remember though the old saying "The grass is only greener on the other side because of all the cow pies fertilizing it". [1] You may get into a position where you can train up your own team. In this case, you may have some fantastic teams who are a lot like you in many respects.