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>Fat has a lot of calories but it doesn't produce an insulin response So? Why are people so fixated on insulin? >isn't digested nearly as quickly as carbohyd

>Fat has a lot of calories but it doesn't produce an insulin response So? Why are people so fixated on insulin? >isn't digested nearly as quickly as carbohydrates, so it keeps you satiated And yet potatoes are the highest satiety food. The whole "fat is filling so you eat fewer calories and lose weight" thing is just a hypothesis that was put forth to explain why people eat fewer calories on low carb diets. It is not fact.

joelrunyon 12y ago
Insulin is elevated when your blood sugar is elevated (which happens when you ingest simple carbs & sugars). When that happens, your body goes from it's fat burning mode (default state) to carb burning. Basically, insulin is elevated and your body starts storing the glucose as glycogen in your muscles. When those stores are full, then it stores the rest as fat. Maintaining normalized insulin levels keeps your body burning fat, which is a slower burning, preferred source of energy, but most people eat so many carbs that their body never relearns how to do it. This isn't rocket science, it's basic biology.
- imanaccount247 12y ago
  >Insulin is elevated when your blood sugar is elevated Insulin is released when your blood sugar is elevated, yes. >When that happens, your body goes from it's fat burning mode (default state) to carb burning That is a complete misrepresentation of reality made by people pushing a fad diet. >When those stores are full, then it stores the rest as fat. So? What do you think it does with fat? >but most people eat so many carbs that their body never relearns how to do it. Your body does not forget how to burn fat, it does it all the time. >This isn't rocket science, it's basic biology. Yes it is. And it does not support this weird fixation on insulin. https://evolvinghealth.wordpress.com/2013/05/22/is-it-time-to-stop-blaming-insulin-for-fat-storage/comment-page-1/ https://evolvinghealth.wordpress.com/2013/05/22/is-it-time-t...
  - joelrunyon 12y ago
    > >When that happens, your body goes from it's fat burning mode (default state) to carb burning > That is a complete misrepresentation of reality made by people pushing a fad diet. What's your understanding that happens then? >When those stores are full, then it stores the rest as fat. >So? What do you think it does with fat? For most people, it stores it as fat and does nothing because most people eat enough carbs (quick burning source of energy) to never have to switch to fat burning.
    - imanaccount247 12y ago
      >What's your understanding that happens then? Read the link. >For most people, it stores it as fat and does nothing because most people eat enough carbs (quick burning source of energy) to never have to switch to fat burning. So insulin is a problem because of what then? And how is that different from what would happen if you replaced those carbs with fats? (Please don't actually answer with the keto nonsense, read the link and see that the answer is "nothing would change").
      - 1stop 12y ago
        > Read the link. Were you the author of that link? Because if not, then that is someone else's understanding, what is yours? You've yet to describe it. > Please don't actually answer with the keto nonsense? Are you actually denying ketosis[0] exists? Or are you claiming it isn't reached through carb-restriction[1]? I haven't quite understood you point (mostly because you haven't really made one), but it seems science disagrees with you :\ [0] http://scholar.google.com.au/scholar?hl=en&q=ketosis http://scholar.google.com.au/scholar?hl=en&q=ketosis <-- I'd say the academic community disagrees with you. [1] http://scholar.google.com.au/scholar?q=ketogenic http://scholar.google.com.au/scholar?q=ketogenic <-- Again, the academic community disagrees with you.
        imanaccount247 12y ago
        >Are you actually denying ketosis[0] exists? Or are you claiming it isn't reached through carb-restriction[1]? No. What is the purpose of ignoring what I posted and asking completely random non-sequitur questions? Are you actually denying pancakes exist? Or claiming they aren't made with flour?
- csirac2 12y ago
  As a type 1 diabetic I can tell you that eating fat requires insulin commensurate with the energy it has. My own mental model of fat elevating my blood sugar level compared to other forms of energy is the rate at which it happens: somewhat slower than simple sugars, and much faster than complex carbohydrates.
NoPiece 12y ago
Note, however, that the methodology of this particular study may have contributed to an artificially high satiety value for potatoes. Per the study's design, the participants were separately fed 220-Calorie servings of each food. A 220-Calorie serving of plain potatoes is larger and much less palatable than the other foods studied. The size of this serving may have influenced a repulsion to this test food that goes beyond the normal satiating response. http://nutritiondata.self.com/topics/fullness-factor http://nutritiondata.self.com/topics/fullness-factor
- imanaccount247 12y ago
  See my other response: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8744945 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8744945 Summary: "I don't like the evidence so I'll ignore it" is not compelling. Being a low calorie, high volume food is not "artificial" satiety, it is satiety.
  - kyllo 12y ago
    It's arguing that poor palatability may have been confused for high satiety. Have you ever eaten a boiled potato with nothing else on it? It tastes terrible. After a couple of bites, you don't want any more. That is not the same thing as satiety. The starch in potatoes is also digested very quickly, so it doesn't keep you satiated for long unless consumed with fats.
    - imanaccount247 12y ago
      >It's arguing that poor palatability may have been confused for high satiety. I know that. And I am saying they are basing that on nothing. They just said "the data is less important than what we think the data should look like based on our feelings". >Have you ever eaten a boiled potato with nothing else on it? It tastes terrible Yes, they taste fine. Obviously they taste better with salt and pepper and butter, but they are not unpalatable without them. Have you ever eaten boiled pasta with nothing else on it? How is that more palatable?
    - DanBC 12y ago
kyllo 12y ago
So? Why are people so fixated on insulin? Because insulin regulates the metabolism of carbohydrates and fats by promoting the absorption of glucose from the blood to skeletal muscles and fat tissue and by causing fat to be stored rather than used for energy[1]. Accordingly the body's insulin response has a massive role in weight management, and certain foods invoke a greater insulin response than others. You're one of those "calories in - calories out" guys, I take it? [1]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Insulin http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Insulin
- imanaccount247 12y ago
  >Accordingly the body's insulin response has a massive role in weight management Except this second part does not follow from the first part, and all available evidence suggests it is false. https://evolvinghealth.wordpress.com/2013/05/22/is-it-time-to-stop-blaming-insulin-for-fat-storage/comment-page-1/ https://evolvinghealth.wordpress.com/2013/05/22/is-it-time-t...

joelrunyon 12y ago

Insulin is elevated when your blood sugar is elevated (which happens when you ingest simple carbs & sugars). When that happens, your body goes from it's fat burning mode (default state) to carb burning. Basically, insulin is elevated and your body starts storing the glucose as glycogen in your muscles. When those stores are full, then it stores the rest as fat. Maintaining normalized insulin levels keeps your body burning fat, which is a slower burning, preferred source of energy, but most people eat so many carbs that their body never relearns how to do it. This isn't rocket science, it's basic biology.

imanaccount247 12y ago
>Insulin is elevated when your blood sugar is elevated Insulin is released when your blood sugar is elevated, yes. >When that happens, your body goes from it's fat burning mode (default state) to carb burning That is a complete misrepresentation of reality made by people pushing a fad diet. >When those stores are full, then it stores the rest as fat. So? What do you think it does with fat? >but most people eat so many carbs that their body never relearns how to do it. Your body does not forget how to burn fat, it does it all the time. >This isn't rocket science, it's basic biology. Yes it is. And it does not support this weird fixation on insulin. https://evolvinghealth.wordpress.com/2013/05/22/is-it-time-to-stop-blaming-insulin-for-fat-storage/comment-page-1/ https://evolvinghealth.wordpress.com/2013/05/22/is-it-time-t...
- joelrunyon 12y ago
  > >When that happens, your body goes from it's fat burning mode (default state) to carb burning > That is a complete misrepresentation of reality made by people pushing a fad diet. What's your understanding that happens then? >When those stores are full, then it stores the rest as fat. >So? What do you think it does with fat? For most people, it stores it as fat and does nothing because most people eat enough carbs (quick burning source of energy) to never have to switch to fat burning.
  - imanaccount247 12y ago
    >What's your understanding that happens then? Read the link. >For most people, it stores it as fat and does nothing because most people eat enough carbs (quick burning source of energy) to never have to switch to fat burning. So insulin is a problem because of what then? And how is that different from what would happen if you replaced those carbs with fats? (Please don't actually answer with the keto nonsense, read the link and see that the answer is "nothing would change").
    - 1stop 12y ago
      > Read the link. Were you the author of that link? Because if not, then that is someone else's understanding, what is yours? You've yet to describe it. > Please don't actually answer with the keto nonsense? Are you actually denying ketosis[0] exists? Or are you claiming it isn't reached through carb-restriction[1]? I haven't quite understood you point (mostly because you haven't really made one), but it seems science disagrees with you :\ [0] http://scholar.google.com.au/scholar?hl=en&q=ketosis http://scholar.google.com.au/scholar?hl=en&q=ketosis <-- I'd say the academic community disagrees with you. [1] http://scholar.google.com.au/scholar?q=ketogenic http://scholar.google.com.au/scholar?q=ketogenic <-- Again, the academic community disagrees with you.
      - imanaccount247 12y ago
        >Are you actually denying ketosis[0] exists? Or are you claiming it isn't reached through carb-restriction[1]? No. What is the purpose of ignoring what I posted and asking completely random non-sequitur questions? Are you actually denying pancakes exist? Or claiming they aren't made with flour?
csirac2 12y ago
As a type 1 diabetic I can tell you that eating fat requires insulin commensurate with the energy it has. My own mental model of fat elevating my blood sugar level compared to other forms of energy is the rate at which it happens: somewhat slower than simple sugars, and much faster than complex carbohydrates.

NoPiece 12y ago

Note, however, that the methodology of this particular study may have contributed to an artificially high satiety value for potatoes. Per the study's design, the participants were separately fed 220-Calorie servings of each food. A 220-Calorie serving of plain potatoes is larger and much less palatable than the other foods studied. The size of this serving may have influenced a repulsion to this test food that goes beyond the normal satiating response. http://nutritiondata.self.com/topics/fullness-factor http://nutritiondata.self.com/topics/fullness-factor

imanaccount247 12y ago
See my other response: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8744945 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8744945 Summary: "I don't like the evidence so I'll ignore it" is not compelling. Being a low calorie, high volume food is not "artificial" satiety, it is satiety.
- kyllo 12y ago
  It's arguing that poor palatability may have been confused for high satiety. Have you ever eaten a boiled potato with nothing else on it? It tastes terrible. After a couple of bites, you don't want any more. That is not the same thing as satiety. The starch in potatoes is also digested very quickly, so it doesn't keep you satiated for long unless consumed with fats.
  - imanaccount247 12y ago
    >It's arguing that poor palatability may have been confused for high satiety. I know that. And I am saying they are basing that on nothing. They just said "the data is less important than what we think the data should look like based on our feelings". >Have you ever eaten a boiled potato with nothing else on it? It tastes terrible Yes, they taste fine. Obviously they taste better with salt and pepper and butter, but they are not unpalatable without them. Have you ever eaten boiled pasta with nothing else on it? How is that more palatable?
  - DanBC 12y ago

kyllo 12y ago

So? Why are people so fixated on insulin? Because insulin regulates the metabolism of carbohydrates and fats by promoting the absorption of glucose from the blood to skeletal muscles and fat tissue and by causing fat to be stored rather than used for energy[1]. Accordingly the body's insulin response has a massive role in weight management, and certain foods invoke a greater insulin response than others. You're one of those "calories in - calories out" guys, I take it? [1]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Insulin http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Insulin

imanaccount247 12y ago
>Accordingly the body's insulin response has a massive role in weight management Except this second part does not follow from the first part, and all available evidence suggests it is false. https://evolvinghealth.wordpress.com/2013/05/22/is-it-time-to-stop-blaming-insulin-for-fat-storage/comment-page-1/ https://evolvinghealth.wordpress.com/2013/05/22/is-it-time-t...