4 ms·
I see part of the problem being an extreme lack of civility in our society. At one point I suppose the police felt they were members of the community. So they
by jqm 12y ago
I see part of the problem being an extreme lack of civility in our society.
At one point I suppose the police felt they were members of the community. So they treated people with some measure of respect and dignity while carrying out their duties. They would see these same people at church, at the store, at baseball games, at funerals etc. So it was different.
Now, the police are often unreasonably rude and hostile immediately and without provocation. For example, the case of M. Brown... sure, it's understood Brown probably did attack the officer and was shot. But, the officer pulls up squealing tires and shouts for Brown to get the F* out of the street. So he gets Brown angry and is physically attacked. Then he _has_ to shoot the kid. Certainly Brown shouldn't have been walking in the middle of the road. But what if the officer had pulled up and said "Fellows, how are you doing today? Can I get you to get off the street? I wouldn't want to see you get run over." Then, if they didn't comply, ramp it up a little bit at a time as needed. Chances are there never would have been a shooting. But as it is, the officers hostile speech and generally dickish attitude led to a situation in which deadly force eventually was used. That officer is morally in the wrong, he did help create this situation, he should be fired, he should be punished.
We should demand our officers act with politeness and basic respect even as they enforce the law. If they can't do the job without behaving like psychotic bullies, we should find some people who can.
On the other hand, looking at the people they deal with day in and day out, it's easy to understand how they could get this attitude. Many citizens officers deal with have no basic respect nor manners themselves. Still... officers should be held the a higher standard (and appropriately compensated if it comes to that). They are still nominally public servants and should be acting in the best interests of the community. A community which includes the people they may be arresting btw.
- A_COMPUTER 12y agoThis is a red herring. I lived around the KS City area for a year and people walking in the middle of the street intentionally obstructing traffic was a thing that happened on a regular basis. They walk in the street while you're driving and glare at you, basically trying to prove they can make you do their will by having to drive around them just walking there. Civility is already gone at that point, it is willful, aggressive disruption. Maybe the cop was dickish, but for the same reason you can't blame Brown's behavior for his homicide, you can't blame Wilson for escalation that would make brown figure he could win a confrontation against a law officer. If Wilson shouldn't have acted like an asshole because it escalated the situation, the it more applies to Brown that he shouldn't have been walking in the street.
- jqm 12y agoIndeed. Both parties are guilty of basic lack of civility (a point which I note). But one party is (in theory), a professional state agent, paid at least in part by the other. (Sounds like you didn't quite make it to the bottom of my post.....). I'm not quite catching your point... it seems to be that Brown was acting up so it was acceptable for Wilson to act as he did. And if that is your point I don't agree. At all. And no, this isn't a "red herring". It is an often overlooked point that is entirely relevant to the issue. The behavior and general attitude of police officers sometimes helps cause these types of situations. Also you say I can't blame Brown for being partially responsible for his own death? I can't blame Wilson for inflaming the situation? Oh yes I can. On both points. And I would be right. Not sure why you would say this...... My point is... we would all be better served if officers behaved in a more respectful manner. So ultimately would they. That people walked around cocky in the street and annoyed you is irrelevant to this simple fact. Two wrongs don't make a right. And one party, in particular, should definitely be expected to be above this behavior. We should demand it.
- A_COMPUTER 12y agoI didn't say you could "blame" either one of them. I said that you are being inconsistent by only attributing total responsibility for escalating a situation that resulted in the confrontation to one party. The fact that Wilson was a professional and Brown wasn't doesn't change that fact, in fact not a single thing said I thought he shouldn't be punished. You are saying "Wilson didn't act within his responsibility." Well, what about Brown breaking the law by walking in the middle of the road? He had a responsibility to not do that, even if he is not a "professional." "Wilson should be held to a higher standard as an officer of the law." Indeed he should, but none of that excuses Brown for escalating it further. Again, there is a very simple calculus that goes into this: if you enter into a confrontation with a police officer, you are not going to win--and this is not underhanded justification for Brown's execution, but the basic fact that the law officer holds all the power. They both can provoke each other, but the costs are much higher for one party than the other. If you think a cop is being a dick to you, recognize that right or wrong, he has the power to kill you and get away with it. I understand your point. I reject it.