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I am confused by "This game has tiers, with high-tier characters consistently beating low-tier characters" leading to a conclusion of "this game is well balance

by Shish2k 12y ago

I am confused by "This game has tiers, with high-tier characters consistently beating low-tier characters" leading to a conclusion of "this game is well balanced", can anyone explain? (Also, anyone have any links for getting into fighting game theory? As someone who's so far only really studied Starcraft, I'm surprised by the depth being discussed here; my own understanding of fighting games is pretty much limited to "mash buttons and die"...)

CocaKoala 12y ago
Here are some links for getting into fighting game theory! First, the pdf "Playing to Win" [1], from shoryuken.com; this is a pretty well-written resource that will go over the basics. There's a youtube clip [2] discussed in the first chapter that demonstrates some important concepts as well. Finally, read through the footsie handbook [3] by, i believe, Dave Sirlin, to learn about what footsies are; they are the most important fundamental skill to a player and what take you from "mash buttons and die" to "beating your friends every single time until they learn footsies of their own" [1]: http://shoryuken.com/srk/FightingGamePrimer.pdf http://shoryuken.com/srk/FightingGamePrimer.pdf [2]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lEIAy7kAeWE&feature=youtu.be https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lEIAy7kAeWE&feature=youtu.be [3]: http://sonichurricane.com/?page_id=1702 http://sonichurricane.com/?page_id=1702 Dave Sirlin has also written a bunch of really interesting stuff on balancing fighting games; you may be interested in his series of articles on how he rebalanced Super Street Fighter II: Super Turbo (http://www.sirlin.net/articles/sf http://www.sirlin.net/articles/sf). Fighting games are actually incredibly interesting to play and to watch! I know that all of this stuff can be overwhelming, but good fighting games are surprisingly deep. You should give them a try!
pselbert 12y ago
Well balanced in street fighter terms comes down to the saturation of tiers, and how diverse top level play can be. Every fighting game has a high tier, no matter how well balanced they try to make it. The interesting part is how tiers evolve over the lifetime of a game. New tactics are discovered, strengths and weaknesses shift and the game moves on. There are a lot of factors that come into tournament play beyond inherent tiers. Matchup experience, fatigue, ego, execution percentage, mind games. It's a far more interesting world than it may seem at first glance.
dragontamer 12y ago
All games have tiers. Compare Street Fighter IV to MvC2, where there were like 4 or 5 tournament-playable characters out of a cast of ~40+. Having a huge cast as part of "Tier1" is a great sign for balance. There are too many characters in most fighting games to expect the game to be balanced across all characters.

by Shish2k 12y ago

CocaKoala 12y ago

Here are some links for getting into fighting game theory! First, the pdf "Playing to Win" [1], from shoryuken.com; this is a pretty well-written resource that will go over the basics. There's a youtube clip [2] discussed in the first chapter that demonstrates some important concepts as well. Finally, read through the footsie handbook [3] by, i believe, Dave Sirlin, to learn about what footsies are; they are the most important fundamental skill to a player and what take you from "mash buttons and die" to "beating your friends every single time until they learn footsies of their own" [1]: http://shoryuken.com/srk/FightingGamePrimer.pdf http://shoryuken.com/srk/FightingGamePrimer.pdf [2]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lEIAy7kAeWE&feature=youtu.be https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lEIAy7kAeWE&feature=youtu.be [3]: http://sonichurricane.com/?page_id=1702 http://sonichurricane.com/?page_id=1702 Dave Sirlin has also written a bunch of really interesting stuff on balancing fighting games; you may be interested in his series of articles on how he rebalanced Super Street Fighter II: Super Turbo (http://www.sirlin.net/articles/sf http://www.sirlin.net/articles/sf). Fighting games are actually incredibly interesting to play and to watch! I know that all of this stuff can be overwhelming, but good fighting games are surprisingly deep. You should give them a try!

pselbert 12y ago

Well balanced in street fighter terms comes down to the saturation of tiers, and how diverse top level play can be. Every fighting game has a high tier, no matter how well balanced they try to make it. The interesting part is how tiers evolve over the lifetime of a game. New tactics are discovered, strengths and weaknesses shift and the game moves on. There are a lot of factors that come into tournament play beyond inherent tiers. Matchup experience, fatigue, ego, execution percentage, mind games. It's a far more interesting world than it may seem at first glance.

dragontamer 12y ago

All games have tiers. Compare Street Fighter IV to MvC2, where there were like 4 or 5 tournament-playable characters out of a cast of ~40+. Having a huge cast as part of "Tier1" is a great sign for balance. There are too many characters in most fighting games to expect the game to be balanced across all characters.