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>"The Republicans have issued a rebuttal. I assume this means they support torture." >"Clapper has issued a rebuttal, claiming that the report isn't neutral. I

by sd8f9iu 12y ago

>"The Republicans have issued a rebuttal. I assume this means they support torture." >"Clapper has issued a rebuttal, claiming that the report isn't neutral. I assume he also supports torture." >"The White House attempted to keep this report from coming out...I assume that the White House supports torture..." Politics is a dirty, complex game. If you treat every news event as black and white like this, you will form many extremist positions very quickly. Obama, for example, banned torture via executive order when he took office. Did you cry that he was "against torture" when that came out?

disposition2 12y ago
This is black and white, unless you have no morals. We tortured people and now some people are defending those actions.
- tinalumfoil 12y ago
  Let me ask you this: What if this report came out and said the exact opposite? What would your reaction be if the interrogation techniques were in no way overly brutal, if everything was done to the books, and the information collected saved millions of lives. I'm going to take a guess and say you'd be very skeptical of the contents. Maybe you'd go so far as to say everything about the document was a lie perpetrated by the Republican party and other supporters of "advanced interrogation techniques". This is just a prime example of confirmation bias [0]. If a report comes out saying torture has worked, you dismiss it. If a report comes out saying the opposite, you hail it as the only evidence that even matters (obviously I'm exaggerating a bit to make my point, but I'm sure you get the idea). A very strongly-sided report just became declassified with little insight into any biases that its writers may have. I highly doubt anyone in the government lacks the integrity to put out a completely fake report of this caliber, but everyone should be looking at this with at least a little cynicism. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias
cryoshon 12y ago
Torture is a cut and dry moral issue; inflicting pain on a person willfully for an extended period of time is not acceptable behavior, nor is this fact a matter of politics. The people/groups I listed in my original comment have placed themselves on the wrong side of this moral issue, and history will judge them harshly as such. Obama may have issued an executive order when he entered office, but attempting to block/redact/delay this report betrays his true loyalties. It isn't an extremist position that torture is wrong, or that the people who support/cover up torture are in the wrong. If anything, it is an extremist position that torture is a valid tactic.
- sd8f9iu 12y ago
  Yes, torture is a pretty cut and dry moral issue. That does not mean the people/groups you listed are "for torture" based on the small sample of reactions you listed. I would not describe the Obama administration as being "for torture" just for going against the report (can you source that by the way? I can't find it). Maybe they genuinely thought unrest in its aftermath would pose a security risk? I don't think this is really what they thought, hence, the report was released. Likewise, perhaps the Republican party views the report as inaccurate, but not that torture is justified in general (given past members' support for the programs, I doubt this too, but still).
- rayiner 12y ago
  Apparently 2/3 of Americans are on the wrong side of this "cut and dry moral issue." http://hotair.com/archives/2014/04/09/poll-68-of-americans-say-torture-against-terrorists-is-justified-in-some-circumstances/ http://hotair.com/archives/2014/04/09/poll-68-of-americans-s...
  - arrrg 12y ago
    That’s quite irrelevant.
  - thizzbuzz 12y ago
    It wouldn't be the first time that 2/3 of Americans support something atrocious. Slavery, voting rights, segregation, senseless wars, drug laws, gay rights, etc.

by sd8f9iu 12y ago

disposition2 12y ago

This is black and white, unless you have no morals. We tortured people and now some people are defending those actions.

tinalumfoil 12y ago
Let me ask you this: What if this report came out and said the exact opposite? What would your reaction be if the interrogation techniques were in no way overly brutal, if everything was done to the books, and the information collected saved millions of lives. I'm going to take a guess and say you'd be very skeptical of the contents. Maybe you'd go so far as to say everything about the document was a lie perpetrated by the Republican party and other supporters of "advanced interrogation techniques". This is just a prime example of confirmation bias [0]. If a report comes out saying torture has worked, you dismiss it. If a report comes out saying the opposite, you hail it as the only evidence that even matters (obviously I'm exaggerating a bit to make my point, but I'm sure you get the idea). A very strongly-sided report just became declassified with little insight into any biases that its writers may have. I highly doubt anyone in the government lacks the integrity to put out a completely fake report of this caliber, but everyone should be looking at this with at least a little cynicism. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias

cryoshon 12y ago

Torture is a cut and dry moral issue; inflicting pain on a person willfully for an extended period of time is not acceptable behavior, nor is this fact a matter of politics. The people/groups I listed in my original comment have placed themselves on the wrong side of this moral issue, and history will judge them harshly as such. Obama may have issued an executive order when he entered office, but attempting to block/redact/delay this report betrays his true loyalties. It isn't an extremist position that torture is wrong, or that the people who support/cover up torture are in the wrong. If anything, it is an extremist position that torture is a valid tactic.

sd8f9iu 12y ago
Yes, torture is a pretty cut and dry moral issue. That does not mean the people/groups you listed are "for torture" based on the small sample of reactions you listed. I would not describe the Obama administration as being "for torture" just for going against the report (can you source that by the way? I can't find it). Maybe they genuinely thought unrest in its aftermath would pose a security risk? I don't think this is really what they thought, hence, the report was released. Likewise, perhaps the Republican party views the report as inaccurate, but not that torture is justified in general (given past members' support for the programs, I doubt this too, but still).
rayiner 12y ago
Apparently 2/3 of Americans are on the wrong side of this "cut and dry moral issue." http://hotair.com/archives/2014/04/09/poll-68-of-americans-say-torture-against-terrorists-is-justified-in-some-circumstances/ http://hotair.com/archives/2014/04/09/poll-68-of-americans-s...
- arrrg 12y ago
  That’s quite irrelevant.
- thizzbuzz 12y ago
  It wouldn't be the first time that 2/3 of Americans support something atrocious. Slavery, voting rights, segregation, senseless wars, drug laws, gay rights, etc.