4 ms·

It's been shown that torture is among the least effective way of extracting information from unwilling informants. http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/an_fbi_inte

by rqebmm 12y ago

It's been shown that torture is among the least effective way of extracting information from unwilling informants. http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/an_fbi_interrogator_on_the_effectiveness_of_torture/ http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/an_fbi_interrogator_on_the_...

sliverstorm 12y ago
I'm not talking about waterboarding or what have you. I guess I'm just puzzled that things like threats & slaps are being rolled in with waterboarding. Maybe threats & slaps are not the most effective method, sure- that doesn't really matter. It just seems like people are shocked to find fundamentally abusive/manipulative behavior going on at all. Virtually any form of extracting information from an unwilling informant is going to be. Feeding them lies to make them lose hope ("We've captured your co-conspirators") is abusive. Cozying up to them with donuts and backrubs is manipulative. Practically by definition, interrogation on unwilling informants cannot be some friendly, respectful thing.
- rqebmm 12y ago
  Hanns Scharf would disagree. "Scharff was opposed to physically abusing prisoners to obtain information. Learning on the job, Scharff instead relied upon the Luftwaffe's approved list of techniques, which mostly involved making the interrogator seem as if he is his prisoner's greatest advocate while in captivity." And this guy was successful as well. "Scharff's approach has been admiringly cited by top US interrogators, such as Ali Soufan"
  - sliverstorm 12y ago
    Those are still abusive relationships, that he established with his prisoners. Just not physically abusive.
tormeh 12y ago
What is the most effective? Anyway, that's really counter-intuitive. I mean, I guess I could deal with pain, but losing body parts, skin or eyes? I would talk pretty fast.
- dragonwriter 12y ago
  Torture has been shown to be a reasonably good (though not always effective) means of getting people to tell torturers things that they think the torturers want to hear -- whatever the tortured person thinks is most likely to lead to the present cessation of the torture. Its also been shown to be a fairly poor technique, compared to other alternatives, to get accurate, actionable information. As the Senate report itself notes, this was the conclusion of the CIA's own work on interrogation techniques prior to 9/11, which was disregarded in the aftermath of 9/11.
  - waterlesscloud 12y ago
    The White House is apparently not taking a side in the debate over whether it works or not. Which frankly makes me think they believe it does. The easy political win is to say it doesn't, and they aren't taking it. https://twitter.com/peterbakernyt/status/542382617711370240 https://twitter.com/peterbakernyt/status/542382617711370240 "Obama official: White House won’t take sides between CIA, which says interrogations worked, and Senate, which says they didn’t."
    - deleted 12y ago
      [deleted]
    - forgotpasswd3x 12y ago
      Sure wish Obama could just grow a pair already.
- rqebmm 12y ago
  Basically, the most effective means is to create a rapport with the subject, and if treated with compassion and respect, eventually some will come around to their captor's side and reveal whatever information they have. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hanns_Scharff http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hanns_Scharff http://www.k-state.edu/actr/2010/12/20/suspect-interrogation-communication-strategies-and-key-personality-constructs-jessica-heuback/default.htm http://www.k-state.edu/actr/2010/12/20/suspect-interrogation...
- 12y ago

by rqebmm 12y ago

sliverstorm 12y ago

I'm not talking about waterboarding or what have you. I guess I'm just puzzled that things like threats & slaps are being rolled in with waterboarding. Maybe threats & slaps are not the most effective method, sure- that doesn't really matter. It just seems like people are shocked to find fundamentally abusive/manipulative behavior going on at all. Virtually any form of extracting information from an unwilling informant is going to be. Feeding them lies to make them lose hope ("We've captured your co-conspirators") is abusive. Cozying up to them with donuts and backrubs is manipulative. Practically by definition, interrogation on unwilling informants cannot be some friendly, respectful thing.

rqebmm 12y ago
Hanns Scharf would disagree. "Scharff was opposed to physically abusing prisoners to obtain information. Learning on the job, Scharff instead relied upon the Luftwaffe's approved list of techniques, which mostly involved making the interrogator seem as if he is his prisoner's greatest advocate while in captivity." And this guy was successful as well. "Scharff's approach has been admiringly cited by top US interrogators, such as Ali Soufan"
- sliverstorm 12y ago
  Those are still abusive relationships, that he established with his prisoners. Just not physically abusive.

tormeh 12y ago

What is the most effective? Anyway, that's really counter-intuitive. I mean, I guess I could deal with pain, but losing body parts, skin or eyes? I would talk pretty fast.

dragonwriter 12y ago
Torture has been shown to be a reasonably good (though not always effective) means of getting people to tell torturers things that they think the torturers want to hear -- whatever the tortured person thinks is most likely to lead to the present cessation of the torture. Its also been shown to be a fairly poor technique, compared to other alternatives, to get accurate, actionable information. As the Senate report itself notes, this was the conclusion of the CIA's own work on interrogation techniques prior to 9/11, which was disregarded in the aftermath of 9/11.
- waterlesscloud 12y ago
  The White House is apparently not taking a side in the debate over whether it works or not. Which frankly makes me think they believe it does. The easy political win is to say it doesn't, and they aren't taking it. https://twitter.com/peterbakernyt/status/542382617711370240 https://twitter.com/peterbakernyt/status/542382617711370240 "Obama official: White House won’t take sides between CIA, which says interrogations worked, and Senate, which says they didn’t."
  - deleted 12y ago
    [deleted]
  - forgotpasswd3x 12y ago
    Sure wish Obama could just grow a pair already.
rqebmm 12y ago
Basically, the most effective means is to create a rapport with the subject, and if treated with compassion and respect, eventually some will come around to their captor's side and reveal whatever information they have. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hanns_Scharff http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hanns_Scharff http://www.k-state.edu/actr/2010/12/20/suspect-interrogation-communication-strategies-and-key-personality-constructs-jessica-heuback/default.htm http://www.k-state.edu/actr/2010/12/20/suspect-interrogation...
12y ago