2 ms·

"benefit confers economic value on that parking space" Another way to look at it, is it increases demand for land in the burbs, where there's free parking. Th

by VLM 12y ago

"benefit confers economic value on that parking space" Another way to look at it, is it increases demand for land in the burbs, where there's free parking. There's no obvious inherent benefit to shopping downtown where I work or in the burbs where I live. Theoretically centralization would benefit everyone. However no one shops downtown if they can avoid it, the parking situation is horrendous and high rents mean higher prices. So all my retail shopping is done in the burbs. Which means higher land demand in the burbs (both for the stores, and the free parking). There are ancillary cultural effects. If you partition an area into "you only go there because you have to go there because there's no free parking and no retail" vs "you go there because you want to, and there's free parking" the coincidence sets up inappropriate beliefs, like free parking is a universal good or paying to park is a universal bad. Reality is its more like a circus ride where if your land prices exceed $X/sq foot then both free parking and retail are inherently economically inappropriate in those areas, if at all avoidable. Stick a super expensive office building on that land instead, etc. Shoppers and their freely parked cars don't belong in areas that cost $2000/sq foot, especially if $20/sq ft is a ten minute drive out of the city.

jeffasinger 12y ago
Not all shopping has to be done with a SUV in a large parking lot. Retail does not require parking if there is a large population within walking/easy public transit access. I'll give my neighborhood as an example. I live in a small city, outside of the most urban part, where most buildings are houses on 1/10 of acre lots. Population density is about 10,000 per square mile. Pretty much everyone has a car, however most local businesses don't have any off street parking. The side streets tend to have free parking (there's always enough), and the main streets tend to have metered parking. Plenty of people come here from the suburbs to shop, because there are unique, local stores you're not going to find at a mall, and there's plenty of good places to eat and drink. The businesses don't have to provide nearly as much parking, because they have several thousand potential customers within a short walk.
- mjevans 12y ago
  The setup you're describing is, if at all urban, only barely so. Really on an area average you've just described a suburbs which happened to develop with a dense enough core that there is little or no 'free parking' for the businesses. It would be like me picking out the area called 'west Seattle' (one of the near by suburbs of Seattle) when I should really be talking about Seattle as the urban environment.
CalRobert 12y ago
"...no one shops downtown if they can avoid it." Source please. My experience, with my friends and coworkers, is that nobody leaves downtown to shop if they can avoid it. It is quite possible that False Consensus effect is coming in to play here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False-consensus_effect http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False-consensus_effect I don't mean to be rude, I just think you (and perhaps me too!) may have some inaccurate assumptions about how people behave. You shop in the burbs. I avoid the burbs with every fiber of my being (grew up there, hope never to return).

by VLM 12y ago

jeffasinger 12y ago

Not all shopping has to be done with a SUV in a large parking lot. Retail does not require parking if there is a large population within walking/easy public transit access. I'll give my neighborhood as an example. I live in a small city, outside of the most urban part, where most buildings are houses on 1/10 of acre lots. Population density is about 10,000 per square mile. Pretty much everyone has a car, however most local businesses don't have any off street parking. The side streets tend to have free parking (there's always enough), and the main streets tend to have metered parking. Plenty of people come here from the suburbs to shop, because there are unique, local stores you're not going to find at a mall, and there's plenty of good places to eat and drink. The businesses don't have to provide nearly as much parking, because they have several thousand potential customers within a short walk.

mjevans 12y ago
The setup you're describing is, if at all urban, only barely so. Really on an area average you've just described a suburbs which happened to develop with a dense enough core that there is little or no 'free parking' for the businesses. It would be like me picking out the area called 'west Seattle' (one of the near by suburbs of Seattle) when I should really be talking about Seattle as the urban environment.

CalRobert 12y ago

"...no one shops downtown if they can avoid it." Source please. My experience, with my friends and coworkers, is that nobody leaves downtown to shop if they can avoid it. It is quite possible that False Consensus effect is coming in to play here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False-consensus_effect http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False-consensus_effect I don't mean to be rude, I just think you (and perhaps me too!) may have some inaccurate assumptions about how people behave. You shop in the burbs. I avoid the burbs with every fiber of my being (grew up there, hope never to return).