5 ms·

This the right answer. Desalination is a last resort, that's why its used in places like Israel where there's no other option. Desalination is enormously energy

by nether 12y ago

This the right answer. Desalination is a last resort, that's why its used in places like Israel where there's no other option. Desalination is enormously energy inefficient.

ghshephard 12y ago
Energy Inefficient for Agriculture use. The cost/efficiency of Desalination has dropped dramatically in the last 10 years. Singapore buys its water for $0.75/m^3. Plenty cheap for residential use.
- z92 12y ago
  .75 USD or Singapore Dollars?
  - ghshephard 12y ago
    Thanks for the correction, it's actually $0.49 USD m^3. http://www.edie.net/news/3/Black--Veatch-Designed-Desalination-Plant-Wins-Global-Water-Distinction/11402/ http://www.edie.net/news/3/Black--Veatch-Designed-Desalinati... Energy Consumption is 4.2kWhr/m3 - and that was in 2006. Presumably technology is improving. With reasonable conservation efforts (low flush toilets, low-flow showers, water efficient washing machine and dish washer) the average individual needs 200 liters a day, which, with desalination, would cost $0.10/day/person or $3/month to supply, (not including transportation - which isn't too expensive for coastal cities).
    - ghshephard 12y ago
      Follow on article: http://www.waterworld.com/articles/2013/09/singapore-s-second-desalination-facility-set-to-open-with-combined-power-plant.html http://www.waterworld.com/articles/2013/09/singapore-s-secon... The 25-year WPA will see Hyflux deliver desalinated water – through a Design, Build, Own and Operate (DBOO) model - at a fixed low price of S$0.45 (USD $.36) per cubic metre for the first year Singapore has been leading the way with desalination research, with projects hoping to reduce current energy requirements for membrane desalination from 3.5 kWh to 0.8 kWh/m3, including work on biomimetic membranes If they do get it to .8 kWh/m^3, I expect we'll see wide(r) spread deployment in arid coastal regions like California for residential use.
- dredmorbius 12y ago
  Just for comparison, recent California ag water rates are $400 - $500 per acre-foot in San Diego -- a historically high cost (2011 article): http://switchboard.nrdc.org/blogs/bnelson/price_matters_-_water_conserva.html http://switchboard.nrdc.org/blogs/bnelson/price_matters_-_wa... The Metropolitan Water District of Southern California cites rates of about $100 - $300 per acre-foot: http://www.mwdh2o.com/mwdh2o/pages/finance/finance_03.html http://www.mwdh2o.com/mwdh2o/pages/finance/finance_03.html An acre-foot is 1,233 cubic meters, so at $0.75/m^3, that cost would be $925. That's actually not too outrageously much higher then the quoted water rates, and the article discusses ag rates as high as $1,400/acre-foot, which would be higher than the desal rates you quote. I was expecting desalination to be far less reasonable. It's not cheap, by a long shot, but if the values you're citing are valid, it's not beyond consideration. Also note that ag water isn't fully treated municipal water supply, which is more expensive.
  - ghshephard 12y ago
    Further research shows my numbers are outdated. Current pricing, for 20 year contracts, are $USD 0.36/M^3. http://www.waterworld.com/articles/2013/09/singapore-s-second-desalination-facility-set-to-open-with-combined-power-plant.html http://www.waterworld.com/articles/2013/09/singapore-s-secon...
    - dredmorbius 12y ago
      Good info, thanks. That's about $630/acre-foot.

by nether 12y ago

This the right answer. Desalination is a last resort, that's why its used in places like Israel where there's no other option. Desalination is enormously energy inefficient.

ghshephard 12y ago

Energy Inefficient for Agriculture use. The cost/efficiency of Desalination has dropped dramatically in the last 10 years. Singapore buys its water for $0.75/m^3. Plenty cheap for residential use.

z92 12y ago
.75 USD or Singapore Dollars?
- ghshephard 12y ago
  Thanks for the correction, it's actually $0.49 USD m^3. http://www.edie.net/news/3/Black--Veatch-Designed-Desalination-Plant-Wins-Global-Water-Distinction/11402/ http://www.edie.net/news/3/Black--Veatch-Designed-Desalinati... Energy Consumption is 4.2kWhr/m3 - and that was in 2006. Presumably technology is improving. With reasonable conservation efforts (low flush toilets, low-flow showers, water efficient washing machine and dish washer) the average individual needs 200 liters a day, which, with desalination, would cost $0.10/day/person or $3/month to supply, (not including transportation - which isn't too expensive for coastal cities).
  - ghshephard 12y ago
    Follow on article: http://www.waterworld.com/articles/2013/09/singapore-s-second-desalination-facility-set-to-open-with-combined-power-plant.html http://www.waterworld.com/articles/2013/09/singapore-s-secon... The 25-year WPA will see Hyflux deliver desalinated water – through a Design, Build, Own and Operate (DBOO) model - at a fixed low price of S$0.45 (USD $.36) per cubic metre for the first year Singapore has been leading the way with desalination research, with projects hoping to reduce current energy requirements for membrane desalination from 3.5 kWh to 0.8 kWh/m3, including work on biomimetic membranes If they do get it to .8 kWh/m^3, I expect we'll see wide(r) spread deployment in arid coastal regions like California for residential use.
dredmorbius 12y ago
Just for comparison, recent California ag water rates are $400 - $500 per acre-foot in San Diego -- a historically high cost (2011 article): http://switchboard.nrdc.org/blogs/bnelson/price_matters_-_water_conserva.html http://switchboard.nrdc.org/blogs/bnelson/price_matters_-_wa... The Metropolitan Water District of Southern California cites rates of about $100 - $300 per acre-foot: http://www.mwdh2o.com/mwdh2o/pages/finance/finance_03.html http://www.mwdh2o.com/mwdh2o/pages/finance/finance_03.html An acre-foot is 1,233 cubic meters, so at $0.75/m^3, that cost would be $925. That's actually not too outrageously much higher then the quoted water rates, and the article discusses ag rates as high as $1,400/acre-foot, which would be higher than the desal rates you quote. I was expecting desalination to be far less reasonable. It's not cheap, by a long shot, but if the values you're citing are valid, it's not beyond consideration. Also note that ag water isn't fully treated municipal water supply, which is more expensive.
- ghshephard 12y ago
  Further research shows my numbers are outdated. Current pricing, for 20 year contracts, are $USD 0.36/M^3. http://www.waterworld.com/articles/2013/09/singapore-s-second-desalination-facility-set-to-open-with-combined-power-plant.html http://www.waterworld.com/articles/2013/09/singapore-s-secon...
  - dredmorbius 12y ago
    Good info, thanks. That's about $630/acre-foot.