4 ms·

it was never a handful of people, the US is a convenient bogey man regardless of its actions. Combined with the revulsion that Islam in that area has for Wester

it was never a handful of people, the US is a convenient bogey man regardless of its actions. Combined with the revulsion that Islam in that area has for Western culture and its not likely anything we do one or another has much effect. Blaming the Iraq war for their dislike of us is about as silly as it gets, they didn't like us before. The key differences now is that technology allows such groups to better organize than ever before.

pyre 12y ago
There is a difference between a general dislike and an active dislike. There are plenty of people there who will blame the US for specific deaths of people close to them. This motivates people a lot more than some general "I don't like those people much" idea.
deleted 12y ago
[deleted]
guelo 12y ago
Your suggestion that invading armies have no effect on "dislike" (also known as resistance) doesn't seem plausible. Many Arabs went from "that crazy bin Laden is a conspiracy theorist" to "bi Laden is right, America is our enemy".
MCRed 12y ago
> "Blaming the Iraq war for their dislike of us is about as silly as it gets, they didn't like us before." Actually, I'd love to hear a better explanation for the Iraq war. Because I've not heard one that wasn't silly. Iraqi's didn't like us and didn't like us before? Have you met many Iraqis? Remember this was a relatively modern, westernish country. The average Iraqi liked america, our freedom, and wish they could be liberated from Saddam. (this is not a justification for the war with Iraq, in my mind, but neither is the 9/11 event which involved Saudis and had no apparent connection to Iraq.) How about Iranians. Do you think Iranians hate westerners? Reports from people visiting Iran, and the Iranians I have known disagree with that position. Again, also a relatively modern society, though with an even more religious government than Iraq. I think you might be making the mistake that many make of conflating the views of "leaders" (often self described) or "government" with "the people". On the other hand, take an individual Iraqi or Afghani father, who lost his wife and kids to a drone attack that only killed civilians. Do you think he might hate america? Quite possibly. But that was not "before", that is only "since" the drone attacks started. I imagine there are many kids who were teenagers who lost their fathers and or mothers to drone attacks in the last 10 years who will grow up to hate americans, and some of them may turn out to be terrorists. The "War on terrorism" is using tactics that create terrorists.
- girvo 12y ago
  > tactics that create terrorists Closed as WONTFIX: this is a feature not a bug.
dragonwriter 12y ago
> Blaming the Iraq war for their dislike of us is about as silly as it gets, they didn't like us before. Which Iraq war are you referring to? Iraq -- people and government -- was generally favorable to the US prior to the 1991 war. For generally diametrically opposed reasons between the government and large segments of the populace, that was significantly less true prior to the 2003 war (the government was anti-US for the US fighting the 1991 war, large segments of the populace that weren't favorable to the government were less pro-US than before the 1991 war because they felt betrayed by not being supported by the US in the aftermath of that war.) But certainly there were a whole new set of sources of anti-US sentiment resulting from the conduct of the 2003 war and, perhaps more importantly, the occupation after the defeat of Saddam's regime.

pyre 12y ago

There is a difference between a general dislike and an active dislike. There are plenty of people there who will blame the US for specific deaths of people close to them. This motivates people a lot more than some general "I don't like those people much" idea.

deleted 12y ago

[deleted]

guelo 12y ago

Your suggestion that invading armies have no effect on "dislike" (also known as resistance) doesn't seem plausible. Many Arabs went from "that crazy bin Laden is a conspiracy theorist" to "bi Laden is right, America is our enemy".

MCRed 12y ago

> "Blaming the Iraq war for their dislike of us is about as silly as it gets, they didn't like us before." Actually, I'd love to hear a better explanation for the Iraq war. Because I've not heard one that wasn't silly. Iraqi's didn't like us and didn't like us before? Have you met many Iraqis? Remember this was a relatively modern, westernish country. The average Iraqi liked america, our freedom, and wish they could be liberated from Saddam. (this is not a justification for the war with Iraq, in my mind, but neither is the 9/11 event which involved Saudis and had no apparent connection to Iraq.) How about Iranians. Do you think Iranians hate westerners? Reports from people visiting Iran, and the Iranians I have known disagree with that position. Again, also a relatively modern society, though with an even more religious government than Iraq. I think you might be making the mistake that many make of conflating the views of "leaders" (often self described) or "government" with "the people". On the other hand, take an individual Iraqi or Afghani father, who lost his wife and kids to a drone attack that only killed civilians. Do you think he might hate america? Quite possibly. But that was not "before", that is only "since" the drone attacks started. I imagine there are many kids who were teenagers who lost their fathers and or mothers to drone attacks in the last 10 years who will grow up to hate americans, and some of them may turn out to be terrorists. The "War on terrorism" is using tactics that create terrorists.

girvo 12y ago
> tactics that create terrorists Closed as WONTFIX: this is a feature not a bug.

dragonwriter 12y ago

> Blaming the Iraq war for their dislike of us is about as silly as it gets, they didn't like us before. Which Iraq war are you referring to? Iraq -- people and government -- was generally favorable to the US prior to the 1991 war. For generally diametrically opposed reasons between the government and large segments of the populace, that was significantly less true prior to the 2003 war (the government was anti-US for the US fighting the 1991 war, large segments of the populace that weren't favorable to the government were less pro-US than before the 1991 war because they felt betrayed by not being supported by the US in the aftermath of that war.) But certainly there were a whole new set of sources of anti-US sentiment resulting from the conduct of the 2003 war and, perhaps more importantly, the occupation after the defeat of Saddam's regime.