16 ms·

How NSA and GCHQ are tapping internet cables

231 points by zecg 12y ago

thewarrior 12y ago
"First, the data stream is filtered through what is known as MVR (Massive Volume Reduction), which immediately rejects high-volume, low-value traffic, such as peer-to-peer downloads. This reduces the volume by about 30%." So all ye folks can start disguising your packets as BitTorrent porn downloads now :)
- higherpurpose 12y ago
  It's also how they tried to mislead the public by saying NSA only collects "4 percent" of the world's data" or something - but "forgot" to mention that data could be emails, chats and urls (essentially the content itself), while the majority of the data is stuff like Youtube/Netflix content and torrents.
  - _up 12y ago
    Probably 4% of max cable capacity. But the cables have a lot of unused capacity.
- toomuchtodo 12y ago
  A Truecrypt container shared by Bittorrent would be a bad idea.
  - Phlarp 12y ago
    Why specifically? I always considered this a relatively safe way to transmit encrypted data. Assuming you have secure key exchange worked out, which is always the harder part anyway.
    - smtddr 12y ago
      I'm not sure if this is what the OP meant, but this[1] is what I think of when I hear anyone mention "Truecrypt". 1. http://motherboard.vice.com/read/nsa-paranoia-has-fanned-the-flames-of-truecrypt-conspiracy-theories http://motherboard.vice.com/read/nsa-paranoia-has-fanned-the...
      - Phlarp 12y ago
        Ah, I guess I should have qualified my statement with "assuming the underlying crypto of truecrypt is secure, does sharing the ciphertext via bittorrent introduce any further side channel attacks outside of compromising the key exchange?"
  - mahyarm 12y ago
    So long-password protected multipart rar files then!
- avn2109 12y ago
  If you're at all important/a threat, they're paying particular attention to your porn habits so as to bolster their dossier on you. This is for later public release/blackmail purposes.
lorddoig 12y ago
Isn't it interesting that governments can get their act together and come up with big distributed systems crunching tens of Gbps in real time but still continue to implode spectacularly when it comes to large-scale webapps (e.g. Obamacare, UK NHS systems, UK taxation systems.)
- ShinyCyril 12y ago
  I'd say UCAS should be on that list too (always buckled on results day), however I'm not sure that it's government affiliated.
- objclxt 12y ago
  You'd assume that if a GCHQ/NSA IT project went spectacularly off the rails (and I can virtually guarantee it has at some point or the other: you'd have to assume so given how often it happens with defense projects we know about) we wouldn't hear about it anyway.
- secfirstmd 12y ago
  Ha, yeh right. They have proven themselves just as bad as mangaging those projects. In fact it is one of the only areas where the UK Parliament Intelligence and Security Committee has really given them a bit of a kicking. "MI5 abandons multi-million pound IT project" http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/10053240/MI5-abandons-multi-million-pound-IT-project.html http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/10053240/MI5-abandons-...
- cryoshon 12y ago
  Different command structures could be part of the cause. Obamacare was a non-classified civilian project, under the leadership of civilians. The primary fumble was (due to corruption) using a federal-friendly (corrupt and ineffective but known to be loyal) contractor rather than an actual development firm. NSA etc are military operations with honeycombed classification schemes and cellularized access to information. Even if there were failures and waste, we'd never hear of it. I assume that corruption plays less of a role since the concern is on effectiveness, but I have nothing to base that on.
a3n 12y ago
It's not apparent from the post or a skim of the linked article, but "via Schneier" is apparently because Schneier links the article here: https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2014/12/putting_nsagchq.html https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2014/12/putting_nsagc...
- nly 12y ago
  He obviously missed this guy sneaking in the side: https://goo.gl/maps/CsUJE https://goo.gl/maps/CsUJE
deleted 12y ago
[deleted]
sjtgraham 12y ago
FLAG 1 Terminus station on Google maps - https://goo.gl/maps/2kM89 https://goo.gl/maps/2kM89. Note the black clad security guard standing watch.
- knowaveragejoe 12y ago
  Well, you'd expect that from any such facility whether it's involved in spying or not.
rl3 12y ago
It must suck being the people assigned to damage control on these continual document releases. I wonder if NSA and GHCQ are changing program code names as they become compromised, or if at some point they just changed all code names regardless. I suspect the latter. If that is the case, I imagine it was probably a bureaucratic nightmare of biblical proportions.

231 points by zecg 12y ago

"First, the data stream is filtered through what is known as MVR (Massive Volume Reduction), which immediately rejects high-volume, low-value traffic, such as peer-to-peer downloads. This reduces the volume by about 30%." So all ye folks can start disguising your packets as BitTorrent porn downloads now :)

higherpurpose 12y ago
It's also how they tried to mislead the public by saying NSA only collects "4 percent" of the world's data" or something - but "forgot" to mention that data could be emails, chats and urls (essentially the content itself), while the majority of the data is stuff like Youtube/Netflix content and torrents.
- _up 12y ago
  Probably 4% of max cable capacity. But the cables have a lot of unused capacity.
toomuchtodo 12y ago
A Truecrypt container shared by Bittorrent would be a bad idea.
- Phlarp 12y ago
  Why specifically? I always considered this a relatively safe way to transmit encrypted data. Assuming you have secure key exchange worked out, which is always the harder part anyway.
  - smtddr 12y ago
    I'm not sure if this is what the OP meant, but this[1] is what I think of when I hear anyone mention "Truecrypt". 1. http://motherboard.vice.com/read/nsa-paranoia-has-fanned-the-flames-of-truecrypt-conspiracy-theories http://motherboard.vice.com/read/nsa-paranoia-has-fanned-the...
    - Phlarp 12y ago
      Ah, I guess I should have qualified my statement with "assuming the underlying crypto of truecrypt is secure, does sharing the ciphertext via bittorrent introduce any further side channel attacks outside of compromising the key exchange?"
- mahyarm 12y ago
  So long-password protected multipart rar files then!
avn2109 12y ago
If you're at all important/a threat, they're paying particular attention to your porn habits so as to bolster their dossier on you. This is for later public release/blackmail purposes.

lorddoig 12y ago

Isn't it interesting that governments can get their act together and come up with big distributed systems crunching tens of Gbps in real time but still continue to implode spectacularly when it comes to large-scale webapps (e.g. Obamacare, UK NHS systems, UK taxation systems.)

ShinyCyril 12y ago
I'd say UCAS should be on that list too (always buckled on results day), however I'm not sure that it's government affiliated.
objclxt 12y ago
You'd assume that if a GCHQ/NSA IT project went spectacularly off the rails (and I can virtually guarantee it has at some point or the other: you'd have to assume so given how often it happens with defense projects we know about) we wouldn't hear about it anyway.
secfirstmd 12y ago
Ha, yeh right. They have proven themselves just as bad as mangaging those projects. In fact it is one of the only areas where the UK Parliament Intelligence and Security Committee has really given them a bit of a kicking. "MI5 abandons multi-million pound IT project" http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/10053240/MI5-abandons-multi-million-pound-IT-project.html http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/10053240/MI5-abandons-...
cryoshon 12y ago
Different command structures could be part of the cause. Obamacare was a non-classified civilian project, under the leadership of civilians. The primary fumble was (due to corruption) using a federal-friendly (corrupt and ineffective but known to be loyal) contractor rather than an actual development firm. NSA etc are military operations with honeycombed classification schemes and cellularized access to information. Even if there were failures and waste, we'd never hear of it. I assume that corruption plays less of a role since the concern is on effectiveness, but I have nothing to base that on.

a3n 12y ago

It's not apparent from the post or a skim of the linked article, but "via Schneier" is apparently because Schneier links the article here: https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2014/12/putting_nsagchq.html https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2014/12/putting_nsagc...

nly 12y ago
He obviously missed this guy sneaking in the side: https://goo.gl/maps/CsUJE https://goo.gl/maps/CsUJE

deleted 12y ago

[deleted]

sjtgraham 12y ago

FLAG 1 Terminus station on Google maps - https://goo.gl/maps/2kM89 https://goo.gl/maps/2kM89. Note the black clad security guard standing watch.

knowaveragejoe 12y ago
Well, you'd expect that from any such facility whether it's involved in spying or not.

rl3 12y ago

It must suck being the people assigned to damage control on these continual document releases. I wonder if NSA and GHCQ are changing program code names as they become compromised, or if at some point they just changed all code names regardless. I suspect the latter. If that is the case, I imagine it was probably a bureaucratic nightmare of biblical proportions.