5 ms·

Ma.gnolia is now Gnolia

18 points by abraham 17y ago

ErrantX 17y ago
Well there we go... hate to say it but I feel bad to have cut Larry some slack back in the submission last week. Anyone with 10 minutes, wikipedia, the US copyright/trademark website and a bit of thought could have worked out they had no real claim on the name. Having minor experience in a similar matter I emailed Larry with some info I found useful at the time... I wish I hadn't now, and that sucks.
- jhancock 17y ago
  "What I’m really interested in is developing the community and service, and – on a bigger scale – the open web. I’m not interested in pouring my time and resources into an open-ended legal confrontation." Your legal opinions aside, his choice is quite reasonable. Not everyone wants to fight the good fight. Or when you were cutting them some slack last week and emailing free advice, did you also have your wallet open for his legal fund?
  - ErrantX 17y ago
    He didnt need a legal fund; a polite letter or simply ignoring them would have sufficed. There were no lawyers involved. They had no case :)
    - jhancock 17y ago
      I do understand your point of view. Ignoring it was a valid option. However, if he ignored it and the other side actually filed suit, now you have real costs without regard to the suit's merit. These guys made a decision to not let this tie up any further time or potential cost. It does feel like they rolled over too easily, but hey, its their decision.
      - ErrantX 17y ago
        I seriously doubt the court would accept a suit straight up like that. At the very least they would have had to send a legal take down letter. What he got was a personal note from the owner (or whatever); it might have been couched in legalese but there was no legal document :) People get these letters all the time; best to just ignore them (or send a polite but short response). Hey yes it's his decision to roll over; I'd never use Gnolia now though. He hasn't exhibited any common sense.
        jhancock 17y ago
        I have been involved in court cases. Here is my experience: you don't win. You don't get your money back for legal costs. At best, you get to decide when to walk away, let go, and get back to your business if your lucky enough that its still viable after all the energy and money you put into the fight. Courts do not decide to "accept a suit". A judge acts on "evidence" presented by each side, they do not provide their own advice or due diligence in the case. A plaintiff files and the other side defends. Both sides immediately assume costs. If the court does throw the case out for lack of standing, jurisdiction, or other preliminary matter, ok, the defendant "won" that round, but you don't get your money or time back. If you want your money back, you have to either counter sue or petition for it. This puts more time and money at risk. Its a very tough call to decide when to give up or fight. This guy made the decision that his name was not the most important aspect of his business and decided not to fight very early. I think he acted on common sense. Sure he could have waited and gotten drawn into a suit. He decided not to and that is a sign he wants to focus on his product and users, not worry about a moral victory over a name.
spooneybarger 17y ago
there should be a co-operative you can join to be able to get good legal backing so the little guy doesn't have to give in because nothing else makes economic sense. a legal system where by default "might makes right" is pretty scary. when the little guy rolls over to most demands from the big guy because he doesn't have the resources to fight, it completely distorts how a civil society is supposed to operate. you see this in many different fields and yet, very little has been done lately by the little guy to fight it. sad.
- thesethings 17y ago
  I tweeted the other day about something similar. I think there are many cases where basic legal resource could save a lot of heartache. For really "cookie cutter" situations, ideally there'd be something in-between pro-bono, and "make an appointment at my full rate." A directory of cool lawyers, basically. Jay Parkinson, MD is a cool medical doctor who is really trying to change medicine, and does appointments over the Internet for example, people could pay with Paypal. What if lawyers did the same? http://jayparkinsonmd.com/ http://jayparkinsonmd.com/
- blasdel 17y ago
  This little guy only rolled over because he is constitutionally incapable of looking before leaping.
chaosmachine 17y ago
I guess this is the upside of using a un.usual.ly dotted domain.
dangrover 17y ago
I heard they had trouble restoring the backups of the first two letters of their name.
- lurkinggrue 17y ago
  Good one, I now need to clean soda off my monitor.
Tichy 17y ago
Sounds weird. Are there no other flower names that could have been used?

18 points by abraham 17y ago

Well there we go... hate to say it but I feel bad to have cut Larry some slack back in the submission last week. Anyone with 10 minutes, wikipedia, the US copyright/trademark website and a bit of thought could have worked out they had no real claim on the name. Having minor experience in a similar matter I emailed Larry with some info I found useful at the time... I wish I hadn't now, and that sucks.

jhancock 17y ago
"What I’m really interested in is developing the community and service, and – on a bigger scale – the open web. I’m not interested in pouring my time and resources into an open-ended legal confrontation." Your legal opinions aside, his choice is quite reasonable. Not everyone wants to fight the good fight. Or when you were cutting them some slack last week and emailing free advice, did you also have your wallet open for his legal fund?
- ErrantX 17y ago
  He didnt need a legal fund; a polite letter or simply ignoring them would have sufficed. There were no lawyers involved. They had no case :)
  - jhancock 17y ago
    I do understand your point of view. Ignoring it was a valid option. However, if he ignored it and the other side actually filed suit, now you have real costs without regard to the suit's merit. These guys made a decision to not let this tie up any further time or potential cost. It does feel like they rolled over too easily, but hey, its their decision.
    - ErrantX 17y ago
      I seriously doubt the court would accept a suit straight up like that. At the very least they would have had to send a legal take down letter. What he got was a personal note from the owner (or whatever); it might have been couched in legalese but there was no legal document :) People get these letters all the time; best to just ignore them (or send a polite but short response). Hey yes it's his decision to roll over; I'd never use Gnolia now though. He hasn't exhibited any common sense.
      - jhancock 17y ago
        I have been involved in court cases. Here is my experience: you don't win. You don't get your money back for legal costs. At best, you get to decide when to walk away, let go, and get back to your business if your lucky enough that its still viable after all the energy and money you put into the fight. Courts do not decide to "accept a suit". A judge acts on "evidence" presented by each side, they do not provide their own advice or due diligence in the case. A plaintiff files and the other side defends. Both sides immediately assume costs. If the court does throw the case out for lack of standing, jurisdiction, or other preliminary matter, ok, the defendant "won" that round, but you don't get your money or time back. If you want your money back, you have to either counter sue or petition for it. This puts more time and money at risk. Its a very tough call to decide when to give up or fight. This guy made the decision that his name was not the most important aspect of his business and decided not to fight very early. I think he acted on common sense. Sure he could have waited and gotten drawn into a suit. He decided not to and that is a sign he wants to focus on his product and users, not worry about a moral victory over a name.

spooneybarger 17y ago

there should be a co-operative you can join to be able to get good legal backing so the little guy doesn't have to give in because nothing else makes economic sense. a legal system where by default "might makes right" is pretty scary. when the little guy rolls over to most demands from the big guy because he doesn't have the resources to fight, it completely distorts how a civil society is supposed to operate. you see this in many different fields and yet, very little has been done lately by the little guy to fight it. sad.

thesethings 17y ago
I tweeted the other day about something similar. I think there are many cases where basic legal resource could save a lot of heartache. For really "cookie cutter" situations, ideally there'd be something in-between pro-bono, and "make an appointment at my full rate." A directory of cool lawyers, basically. Jay Parkinson, MD is a cool medical doctor who is really trying to change medicine, and does appointments over the Internet for example, people could pay with Paypal. What if lawyers did the same? http://jayparkinsonmd.com/ http://jayparkinsonmd.com/
blasdel 17y ago
This little guy only rolled over because he is constitutionally incapable of looking before leaping.

chaosmachine 17y ago

I guess this is the upside of using a un.usual.ly dotted domain.

dangrover 17y ago

I heard they had trouble restoring the backups of the first two letters of their name.

lurkinggrue 17y ago
Good one, I now need to clean soda off my monitor.

Tichy 17y ago

Sounds weird. Are there no other flower names that could have been used?