4 ms·

Ask HN: Should Google make a web server?

2 points by source99 12y ago

As Google is in the business of making the entire web browsing experience faster, Does it make sense for them to make a new web server(Apache clone)?

dkopi 12y ago
That's pretty much what the google cloud platform is about. https://cloud.google.com/ https://cloud.google.com/
- source99 12y ago
  My question was more specifically about a single piece of software than a infrastructure platform.
mod 12y ago
Is Apache slow in some obvious manner? If so, wouldn't time be better invested in improving that? Since the bulk of the web runs apache, that'd be the best way to improve the speed of the web, no?
- source99 12y ago
  This makes sense but I think the same comment could have been applied to Firefox. But instead of improving Firefox(or in addition to) Google created Chrome. Does Google typically improve open source projects or do they just rewrite them from scratch?
  - hiby007 12y ago
    In case of Chrome, they wanted to capture the market share for their business interests.
  - dkopi 12y ago
    Google created their own browser in order to embed Google search as your default search engine and homepage. Not because of an altruistic quest to make the web faster.
    - Someone1234 12y ago
      Since Firefox already shipped with Google as the default search engine and homepage that argument has flaws.
      - ksherlock 12y ago
        Google pays for that. What happens if Bing or DuckDuckGo write an even bigger check? What happens if Firefox gets stagnant and users switch to IE?
        Someone1234 12y ago
        Right but Google also pays for Chrome development. It isn't free either way.
        dkopi 12y ago
        What happens if firefox starts shipping with yahoo as it's default search engine? http://mashable.com/2014/11/19/firefox-default-yahoo-search/?utm_cid=mash-com-Tw-main-link http://mashable.com/2014/11/19/firefox-default-yahoo-search/...
    - dragonwriter 12y ago
      > Google created their own browser in order to embed Google search as your default search engine and homepage. Not because of an altruistic quest to make the web faster. That's overly simplistic (even the idea that that's the only reason they pay for search placement on Firefox, though that's the direct exchange, is overly simplistic.) For funding Firefox and sponsoring Chrome, their goals included: (1) avoiding a desktop browser monopoly by MS that could be leveraged to favor the favor certain online properties or extract rents from them (e.g., to prevent Google's core business from being "taxed" by MS), and (2) (for Chrome more than Firefox) Drive the shape of browsers (both directly by implementing these features in a browser that would gain substantial use, and indirectly by creating pressure on other browser vendors to do the same) toward capabilities to more fully replace desktop/native apps, and thereby commoditize native platforms so that Google's core competence in the web space would have more reach. Making the web faster was part of this, though altruism isn't necessary to explain it.
  - dragonwriter 12y ago
    > Does Google typically improve open source projects or do they just rewrite them from scratch? Google typically takes multi-pronged approaches to similar problem spaces when they have sufficient resources (which, given the size of the cash hoard they have lying around, they usually do) and their is some uncertainty as to which approach will pay off best (as there quite often is.) So its not really inconsistent with Google's general behavior to see them doing both -- improving the existing product and doing a parallel replacement -- for the same product at the same time.
MalcolmDiggs 12y ago
They did make their own server, they just don't talk about it much. http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/01/29/google_web_server/ http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/01/29/google_web_server/ This the reason you see: server:gws in the response headers when you visit Google.com. The real question is whether or not they should open-source it... and I'd lean in the "yes" direction, but I'm biased.
chuhnk 12y ago
Google has a few web servers internally for different purposes. Maybe they'll open source something one day much like kubernetes, a simplified example of what they have. To be honest web serving is more about configuration than speed. Serving a lot of traffic isn't difficult these days. We solved the c10k problem long ago.

2 points by source99 12y ago

As Google is in the business of making the entire web browsing experience faster, Does it make sense for them to make a new web server(Apache clone)?

dkopi 12y ago

That's pretty much what the google cloud platform is about. https://cloud.google.com/ https://cloud.google.com/

source99 12y ago
My question was more specifically about a single piece of software than a infrastructure platform.

mod 12y ago

Is Apache slow in some obvious manner? If so, wouldn't time be better invested in improving that? Since the bulk of the web runs apache, that'd be the best way to improve the speed of the web, no?

source99 12y ago
This makes sense but I think the same comment could have been applied to Firefox. But instead of improving Firefox(or in addition to) Google created Chrome. Does Google typically improve open source projects or do they just rewrite them from scratch?
- hiby007 12y ago
  In case of Chrome, they wanted to capture the market share for their business interests.
- dkopi 12y ago
  Google created their own browser in order to embed Google search as your default search engine and homepage. Not because of an altruistic quest to make the web faster.
  - Someone1234 12y ago
    Since Firefox already shipped with Google as the default search engine and homepage that argument has flaws.
    - ksherlock 12y ago
      Google pays for that. What happens if Bing or DuckDuckGo write an even bigger check? What happens if Firefox gets stagnant and users switch to IE?
      - Someone1234 12y ago
        Right but Google also pays for Chrome development. It isn't free either way.
      - dkopi 12y ago
        What happens if firefox starts shipping with yahoo as it's default search engine? http://mashable.com/2014/11/19/firefox-default-yahoo-search/?utm_cid=mash-com-Tw-main-link http://mashable.com/2014/11/19/firefox-default-yahoo-search/...
  - dragonwriter 12y ago
    > Google created their own browser in order to embed Google search as your default search engine and homepage. Not because of an altruistic quest to make the web faster. That's overly simplistic (even the idea that that's the only reason they pay for search placement on Firefox, though that's the direct exchange, is overly simplistic.) For funding Firefox and sponsoring Chrome, their goals included: (1) avoiding a desktop browser monopoly by MS that could be leveraged to favor the favor certain online properties or extract rents from them (e.g., to prevent Google's core business from being "taxed" by MS), and (2) (for Chrome more than Firefox) Drive the shape of browsers (both directly by implementing these features in a browser that would gain substantial use, and indirectly by creating pressure on other browser vendors to do the same) toward capabilities to more fully replace desktop/native apps, and thereby commoditize native platforms so that Google's core competence in the web space would have more reach. Making the web faster was part of this, though altruism isn't necessary to explain it.
- dragonwriter 12y ago
  > Does Google typically improve open source projects or do they just rewrite them from scratch? Google typically takes multi-pronged approaches to similar problem spaces when they have sufficient resources (which, given the size of the cash hoard they have lying around, they usually do) and their is some uncertainty as to which approach will pay off best (as there quite often is.) So its not really inconsistent with Google's general behavior to see them doing both -- improving the existing product and doing a parallel replacement -- for the same product at the same time.

MalcolmDiggs 12y ago

They did make their own server, they just don't talk about it much. http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/01/29/google_web_server/ http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/01/29/google_web_server/ This the reason you see: server:gws in the response headers when you visit Google.com. The real question is whether or not they should open-source it... and I'd lean in the "yes" direction, but I'm biased.

chuhnk 12y ago

Google has a few web servers internally for different purposes. Maybe they'll open source something one day much like kubernetes, a simplified example of what they have. To be honest web serving is more about configuration than speed. Serving a lot of traffic isn't difficult these days. We solved the c10k problem long ago.