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Wow, I thought most consumers these days know that generic alkaline batteries are just as good as Duracell alkaline batteries. Also, many gizmos come with cheap

by jstsch 12y ago

Wow, I thought most consumers these days know that generic alkaline batteries are just as good as Duracell alkaline batteries. Also, many gizmos come with cheap lipo built in + an USB port these days, that seems to be the trend. I'd think this is a business on the decline...

gilgoomesh 12y ago
Like the article says: it's about buying commodities (alkaline batteries or their components) and selling a brand. The difference in value is entirely in people's heads but that's still profitable. From my perspective, I haven't bought an alkaline battery in years. Low self-discharge batteries (especially newer Eneloops) are so much better for most tasks that disposable batteries seem crazy.
- p1mrx 12y ago
  The problem with NiMH is that lots of cheap devices are designed to run at 1.5 volts, and have dim lights or sluggish movement when used with 1.2 volt cells. It'd be nice if there were a voltage regulator product that could fit into a standard battery compartment. One option I've considered is to replace 2AA/2AAA with Li-Ion plus a dummy cell. But Li-Ion is around 4.2 volts fully charged, which might be too much.
dingaling 12y ago
Anecdotally, Duracell cells are the only ones in recent memory that have consistently leaked when installed, on numerous occasions. Isn't that a solved problem? So in my experience generics are actually better; Golden Sunrise or whatever, I don't care so long as they are on spec and don't ruin my gadgets.
- CamperBob2 12y ago
  Absolutely. Duracells haven't been allowed in my house for three or four years now. Stay far, far away from these pieces of crap.
tormeh 12y ago
I don't know about averages for generics, but I've definitely bought bad (really cheap..) store-brand batteries that lasted inconveniently short. If it's Duracell I know it's good.
- tanzam75 12y ago
  > I've definitely bought bad (really cheap..) store-brand batteries that lasted inconveniently short. If it's Duracell I know it's good. If you bought the cheapest battery on the shelf, then it probably wasn't an alkaline battery. A heavy-duty battery (carbon-zinc) has half the capacity of an alkaline. If you buy Duracell, you know you will get at least an alkaline battery. Duracell simply does not sell heavy-duty batteries, hence the brand name: the durable cell. It's mostly a matter of brand positioning, rather than technology. Rayovac uses one brand for both alkaline and heavy-duty batteries, which cheapens their brand when a consumer buys the wrong type and all the batteries die a quick death. Energizer addresses this problem by selling heavy-duty batteries under the Everready brand.
  - moreati 12y ago
    It sounds like you know the history. Why are zinc-carbon batteries called 'heavy-duty'?
    - tanzam75 12y ago
      Sorry, I gave the wrong chemistry. The carbon-chloride battery is labeled as "heavy-duty," because it has greater capacity than the carbon-zinc battery ("general-purpose"). When alkaline batteries were invented, the older chemistry continued to be sold as heavy-duty. This leads to the strange situation where the heavy-duty battery has less capacity than the other batteries you find on the shelf.
anigbrowl 12y ago
generic alkaline batteries are just as good as Duracell alkaline batteries As someone who uses a lot of batteries I disagree. I do a lot of field recording work using powered microphones and that can mean going through 20+ batteries a day. Rechargeables would be ideal but that means a bunch of extra gear to cart around and extra things to go wrong or be overlooked by an assistant. Doing location work for film it's common to have 12+18 hour workdays where you're on your feet all the time, and working in a different location every day or ever multiple locations in the same day. Long story short I've had terrible experiences with generic batteries. I haven't done exhaustive comparisons with the various leading brands, but I've come to strongly prefer Duracells. I have no idea what the watt/$ ratio is because I just expense that; what I care about is reliability in a high power drain situation. For consumer stuff sure, most batteries are quite good. I wish it was a business on the decline, I'd be thrilled to have efficient short-range wireless power even if it only had a range of a meter or two.
- Sven7 12y ago
  Just curious. How many wireless mics and made by whom? 20+ batteries a day seems like quite a lot even for wireless mics
  - btgeekboy 12y ago
    Small corporate user's conference: 4 rooms, 2 mics per room, 2 AAs each = 16 batteries. 20 is not that far-fetched.
  - anigbrowl 12y ago
    I'd typically have 2 Sennheiser EW500s, with the receivers and transmitters using 2 AAs each, plus 2 or 4 for a portable recorder, which is feeding 48v phantom power to a condenser microphone or occasionally to two as well as its onboard condensers that I usually have going as a backup. On a long day I'd expect to run down two sets of batteries. It's not very efficient as I often just leave stuff switched on when it could be off, but then you'll usddenly be ready to shoot at short notice and you don't want to be the person holding everything up while you switch 5 different devices back on.
001sky 12y ago
This is mis-information, imho. I'd never trust no-name batteries in the Field. Empirical testing has shown over time they do not hold up. I don't claim to know why, but I just know that cheaper batteries create more landfill waste over time, which means more hassle shopping/disposing of them.They are fine for your bathroom scale, tho.
- pravda 12y ago
  http://www.batteryshowdown.com/ http://www.batteryshowdown.com/ I get my alkaline AA's from Harbor Freight! $4 for 24. Never had a problem with them. Duracell is for suckers. Their slogan is "Duracell is the #1 trusted brand of parents, pharmacists and first responders." Huh?
  - 001sky 12y ago
    Ha. This is why I use Energizer lithiums.
stan_rogers 12y ago
Duracell (formerly Mallory) makes batteries for everything, including things like hearing aids (which go through them like crazy due to the necessarily small size). It's not all about the double-A, it's not even all about the alkaline, and not everything can be recharged practically.
analog31 12y ago
I make a gizmo that runs on batteries, and a few years ago, tested several brands of 9-V alkaline batteries under a load similar to my product (a few milliamps). I also wanted some batteries known to be discharged by a certain amount, to test the performance of my product under those conditions. I tested name brands and the drug store house brand. Within experimental errors, they all had the same lifetime.

by jstsch 12y ago

gilgoomesh 12y ago

Like the article says: it's about buying commodities (alkaline batteries or their components) and selling a brand. The difference in value is entirely in people's heads but that's still profitable. From my perspective, I haven't bought an alkaline battery in years. Low self-discharge batteries (especially newer Eneloops) are so much better for most tasks that disposable batteries seem crazy.

p1mrx 12y ago
The problem with NiMH is that lots of cheap devices are designed to run at 1.5 volts, and have dim lights or sluggish movement when used with 1.2 volt cells. It'd be nice if there were a voltage regulator product that could fit into a standard battery compartment. One option I've considered is to replace 2AA/2AAA with Li-Ion plus a dummy cell. But Li-Ion is around 4.2 volts fully charged, which might be too much.

dingaling 12y ago

Anecdotally, Duracell cells are the only ones in recent memory that have consistently leaked when installed, on numerous occasions. Isn't that a solved problem? So in my experience generics are actually better; Golden Sunrise or whatever, I don't care so long as they are on spec and don't ruin my gadgets.

CamperBob2 12y ago
Absolutely. Duracells haven't been allowed in my house for three or four years now. Stay far, far away from these pieces of crap.

tormeh 12y ago

I don't know about averages for generics, but I've definitely bought bad (really cheap..) store-brand batteries that lasted inconveniently short. If it's Duracell I know it's good.

tanzam75 12y ago
> I've definitely bought bad (really cheap..) store-brand batteries that lasted inconveniently short. If it's Duracell I know it's good. If you bought the cheapest battery on the shelf, then it probably wasn't an alkaline battery. A heavy-duty battery (carbon-zinc) has half the capacity of an alkaline. If you buy Duracell, you know you will get at least an alkaline battery. Duracell simply does not sell heavy-duty batteries, hence the brand name: the durable cell. It's mostly a matter of brand positioning, rather than technology. Rayovac uses one brand for both alkaline and heavy-duty batteries, which cheapens their brand when a consumer buys the wrong type and all the batteries die a quick death. Energizer addresses this problem by selling heavy-duty batteries under the Everready brand.
- moreati 12y ago
  It sounds like you know the history. Why are zinc-carbon batteries called 'heavy-duty'?
  - tanzam75 12y ago
    Sorry, I gave the wrong chemistry. The carbon-chloride battery is labeled as "heavy-duty," because it has greater capacity than the carbon-zinc battery ("general-purpose"). When alkaline batteries were invented, the older chemistry continued to be sold as heavy-duty. This leads to the strange situation where the heavy-duty battery has less capacity than the other batteries you find on the shelf.

anigbrowl 12y ago

generic alkaline batteries are just as good as Duracell alkaline batteries As someone who uses a lot of batteries I disagree. I do a lot of field recording work using powered microphones and that can mean going through 20+ batteries a day. Rechargeables would be ideal but that means a bunch of extra gear to cart around and extra things to go wrong or be overlooked by an assistant. Doing location work for film it's common to have 12+18 hour workdays where you're on your feet all the time, and working in a different location every day or ever multiple locations in the same day. Long story short I've had terrible experiences with generic batteries. I haven't done exhaustive comparisons with the various leading brands, but I've come to strongly prefer Duracells. I have no idea what the watt/$ ratio is because I just expense that; what I care about is reliability in a high power drain situation. For consumer stuff sure, most batteries are quite good. I wish it was a business on the decline, I'd be thrilled to have efficient short-range wireless power even if it only had a range of a meter or two.

Sven7 12y ago
Just curious. How many wireless mics and made by whom? 20+ batteries a day seems like quite a lot even for wireless mics
- btgeekboy 12y ago
  Small corporate user's conference: 4 rooms, 2 mics per room, 2 AAs each = 16 batteries. 20 is not that far-fetched.
- anigbrowl 12y ago
  I'd typically have 2 Sennheiser EW500s, with the receivers and transmitters using 2 AAs each, plus 2 or 4 for a portable recorder, which is feeding 48v phantom power to a condenser microphone or occasionally to two as well as its onboard condensers that I usually have going as a backup. On a long day I'd expect to run down two sets of batteries. It's not very efficient as I often just leave stuff switched on when it could be off, but then you'll usddenly be ready to shoot at short notice and you don't want to be the person holding everything up while you switch 5 different devices back on.

001sky 12y ago

This is mis-information, imho. I'd never trust no-name batteries in the Field. Empirical testing has shown over time they do not hold up. I don't claim to know why, but I just know that cheaper batteries create more landfill waste over time, which means more hassle shopping/disposing of them.They are fine for your bathroom scale, tho.

pravda 12y ago
http://www.batteryshowdown.com/ http://www.batteryshowdown.com/ I get my alkaline AA's from Harbor Freight! $4 for 24. Never had a problem with them. Duracell is for suckers. Their slogan is "Duracell is the #1 trusted brand of parents, pharmacists and first responders." Huh?
- 001sky 12y ago
  Ha. This is why I use Energizer lithiums.

stan_rogers 12y ago

Duracell (formerly Mallory) makes batteries for everything, including things like hearing aids (which go through them like crazy due to the necessarily small size). It's not all about the double-A, it's not even all about the alkaline, and not everything can be recharged practically.

analog31 12y ago

I make a gizmo that runs on batteries, and a few years ago, tested several brands of 9-V alkaline batteries under a load similar to my product (a few milliamps). I also wanted some batteries known to be discharged by a certain amount, to test the performance of my product under those conditions. I tested name brands and the drug store house brand. Within experimental errors, they all had the same lifetime.