3 ms·

No mention of this, though? https://np.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments/2iea97/i_am_a_former_reddit_employee_ama/cl1ygat?context=3 https://np.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comme

No mention of this, though? https://np.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments/2iea97/i_am_a_former_reddit_employee_ama/cl1ygat?context=3 https://np.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments/2iea97/i_am_a_former_r... I would not want to work for any company whose CEO takes the low road on personnel issues. That was truly cringeworthy.

yuhong 12y ago
But the California defamation laws still needs to be fixed. Read http://www.reddit.com/r/bestof/comments/2igkke/reddit_ceo_calls_out_former_reddit_employee_as_to/cl2ditf?context=3 http://www.reddit.com/r/bestof/comments/2igkke/reddit_ceo_ca... (particularly those words highlighted in bold) and weep.
- AYBABTME 12y ago
  I wouldn't say it's California; it's Common Law. It's a legal system that's pretty much everywhere: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Common_law#Common_law_legal_systems_in_the_present_day https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Common_law#Common_law_legal_sy...
- ars 12y ago
  I see nothing wrong with that law. If a company wants to say something negative about someone they better be able to prove it.
  - yuhong 12y ago
    I am talking about the automatic damages and the requirement that it must be fact not opinion for example.
- dkbrk 12y ago
  Statements must be false to be defamatory (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defamation#Truth http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defamation#Truth). While Yishan's actions may be considered unprofessional, he is legally in the clear so long as he was not lying. I think you may be confusing defamation with disparagement; if a non-disparagement contract existed, then Yishan could be in legal trouble.
sillysaurus3 12y ago
Yes, but unless you're suggesting that Yishan was secretly fired because of it, that seems like an unrelated and unnecessary flame. Can't we be nice on HN just once? Maybe we should see Yishan's comment as a sign that he was burnt out?
- codinghorror 12y ago
  From the new york times article: http://mobile.nytimes.com/blogs/bits/2014/11/13/reddit-chief-executive-resigns-as-company-shuffles-top-ranks/?_r=0&referrer= http://mobile.nytimes.com/blogs/bits/2014/11/13/reddit-chief... "Mr. Wong also recently had a public argument with a former employee of the site in which he laid out the terms of his former employee’s termination in excruciating detail. That incident, according to people close to the company, made some of Reddit’s current employees uncomfortable." This was not some minor gaffe. This was a very public, major lapse in leadership judgment from the CEO.
  - sillysaurus3 12y ago
    It's possible, but Occam's Taser (I've decided that's a cooler name) seems to apply. Either Sam and reddit employees and everyone else are risking their public reputation of being trustworthy people by saying things that were obviously untrue (like "Yishan really did resign because he felt like it"), or Yishan left because he chose to. I have a lot of respect for you, and you're not just some random person. Do you feel there's a nonzero chance we're living in a world where nobody can say the truth, and everyone chooses to play along with a social game of "Oh, yes, this is what I really believe, wink wink"? I mean, it's possible, but why believe that? Isn't the simplest explanation that Yishan didn't want the job anymore? If this is a case where the simplest explanation is mistaken, is there any evidence?
    - 001sky 12y ago
      Notwithstanding any relevance here, the entire concept of 'manipulation' is to put forth an easy to follow line of logic that is at once intuitively appealing and deliberately false. With respect to context, the principals involved are too sophisticated to be treated as simpletons-- the principal owners of Reddit are the owners Conde Nast et al. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Advance_Publications https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Advance_Publications
gojomo 12y ago
If an ex-employee of yours was spreading morale- and image-damaging falsehoods about your company, and misrepresented the reasons for their departure, and did this on your own platform no less, how would you respond?
deleted 12y ago
[deleted]
yitchelle 12y ago
"If the job had been a energizing one rather than one that had been so draining, this probably wouldn't have been an issue I resigned over." From this sentence itself, it is a clear sign that he has reached "I am burned out" staged. Time to move on when that stage is reached.
jsmthrowaway 12y ago
I don't know, Jeff, I'm on the fence on that one. I've been in situations where formers just make shit up about the company and trash it in discussion threads around the Internet, and it's a pretty demoralizing experience when none of it is true. My CEO at the time said "no, just ignore it, it'll blow over," which is advice I've hated since grade school when I was told to do that with the kids teasing me (at least now I understand why I was given that advice, but it did take me longer to discover that standing up for yourself pays more dividends). I mean, the situation it creates sucks: we can't say absolutely anything about it but Dickbag McFired can call us all lazy and incompetent all over HN and Reddit? And we just have to take it ... why? Because it'd be bad for the company if we didn't? If my team is getting shit on constantly like that and none of it is true, I can kind of get behind a leader taking a stand and calling bullshit bullshit. I can also see the other side of how some folks would consider it the low road and unprofessional, even though I don't necessarily agree. As I said, on the fence. Part of me appreciated calling bullshit bullshit. Part of me sympathized that he should probably have spoken through a PR mouthpiece. Honestly, I probably would have done the same thing in that situation, and that might be why I'm not a CEO. Real talk: if considering whether or not to work for Yishan, that little incident might slip to the "pro" side instead of the "con" for me. The rest of his management of Reddit, not so clear.
deleted 12y ago
[deleted]

yuhong 12y ago

But the California defamation laws still needs to be fixed. Read http://www.reddit.com/r/bestof/comments/2igkke/reddit_ceo_calls_out_former_reddit_employee_as_to/cl2ditf?context=3 http://www.reddit.com/r/bestof/comments/2igkke/reddit_ceo_ca... (particularly those words highlighted in bold) and weep.

AYBABTME 12y ago
I wouldn't say it's California; it's Common Law. It's a legal system that's pretty much everywhere: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Common_law#Common_law_legal_systems_in_the_present_day https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Common_law#Common_law_legal_sy...
ars 12y ago
I see nothing wrong with that law. If a company wants to say something negative about someone they better be able to prove it.
- yuhong 12y ago
  I am talking about the automatic damages and the requirement that it must be fact not opinion for example.
dkbrk 12y ago
Statements must be false to be defamatory (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defamation#Truth http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defamation#Truth). While Yishan's actions may be considered unprofessional, he is legally in the clear so long as he was not lying. I think you may be confusing defamation with disparagement; if a non-disparagement contract existed, then Yishan could be in legal trouble.

sillysaurus3 12y ago

Yes, but unless you're suggesting that Yishan was secretly fired because of it, that seems like an unrelated and unnecessary flame. Can't we be nice on HN just once? Maybe we should see Yishan's comment as a sign that he was burnt out?

codinghorror 12y ago
From the new york times article: http://mobile.nytimes.com/blogs/bits/2014/11/13/reddit-chief-executive-resigns-as-company-shuffles-top-ranks/?_r=0&referrer= http://mobile.nytimes.com/blogs/bits/2014/11/13/reddit-chief... "Mr. Wong also recently had a public argument with a former employee of the site in which he laid out the terms of his former employee’s termination in excruciating detail. That incident, according to people close to the company, made some of Reddit’s current employees uncomfortable." This was not some minor gaffe. This was a very public, major lapse in leadership judgment from the CEO.
- sillysaurus3 12y ago
  It's possible, but Occam's Taser (I've decided that's a cooler name) seems to apply. Either Sam and reddit employees and everyone else are risking their public reputation of being trustworthy people by saying things that were obviously untrue (like "Yishan really did resign because he felt like it"), or Yishan left because he chose to. I have a lot of respect for you, and you're not just some random person. Do you feel there's a nonzero chance we're living in a world where nobody can say the truth, and everyone chooses to play along with a social game of "Oh, yes, this is what I really believe, wink wink"? I mean, it's possible, but why believe that? Isn't the simplest explanation that Yishan didn't want the job anymore? If this is a case where the simplest explanation is mistaken, is there any evidence?
  - 001sky 12y ago
    Notwithstanding any relevance here, the entire concept of 'manipulation' is to put forth an easy to follow line of logic that is at once intuitively appealing and deliberately false. With respect to context, the principals involved are too sophisticated to be treated as simpletons-- the principal owners of Reddit are the owners Conde Nast et al. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Advance_Publications https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Advance_Publications

gojomo 12y ago

If an ex-employee of yours was spreading morale- and image-damaging falsehoods about your company, and misrepresented the reasons for their departure, and did this on your own platform no less, how would you respond?

deleted 12y ago

[deleted]

yitchelle 12y ago

"If the job had been a energizing one rather than one that had been so draining, this probably wouldn't have been an issue I resigned over." From this sentence itself, it is a clear sign that he has reached "I am burned out" staged. Time to move on when that stage is reached.

jsmthrowaway 12y ago

I don't know, Jeff, I'm on the fence on that one. I've been in situations where formers just make shit up about the company and trash it in discussion threads around the Internet, and it's a pretty demoralizing experience when none of it is true. My CEO at the time said "no, just ignore it, it'll blow over," which is advice I've hated since grade school when I was told to do that with the kids teasing me (at least now I understand why I was given that advice, but it did take me longer to discover that standing up for yourself pays more dividends). I mean, the situation it creates sucks: we can't say absolutely anything about it but Dickbag McFired can call us all lazy and incompetent all over HN and Reddit? And we just have to take it ... why? Because it'd be bad for the company if we didn't? If my team is getting shit on constantly like that and none of it is true, I can kind of get behind a leader taking a stand and calling bullshit bullshit. I can also see the other side of how some folks would consider it the low road and unprofessional, even though I don't necessarily agree. As I said, on the fence. Part of me appreciated calling bullshit bullshit. Part of me sympathized that he should probably have spoken through a PR mouthpiece. Honestly, I probably would have done the same thing in that situation, and that might be why I'm not a CEO. Real talk: if considering whether or not to work for Yishan, that little incident might slip to the "pro" side instead of the "con" for me. The rest of his management of Reddit, not so clear.

deleted 12y ago

[deleted]