5 ms·

I don't find this post snarky, but from a usability point of view I'd love to hear specifics about where you think these designs fail?

by davedx 12y ago

sucramb 12y ago
I feel like the same as OP. Change for the sake of change without any real benefits. But with plenty of draw-backs. For example the new Gmail App on Android now uses an almost unreadable font in the overview. It is "designy" but not good for usability - and I still have 100% eye sight. In general I feel like surrounded by the Microsoft paper clip. There is constantly something animating, popping up or popping with strong colors into your eyes. Try to find in all the talk about material design the underlying reasons for usability. There aren't any. To me it feels like the emperor's new cloths. I was about to buy a Nexus 6 but the new Gmail app is a no go for me and I will avoid it as long as possible.
- calinet6 12y ago
  I mean this in the most respectful way possible, but, your concrete flaws are that you believe it's just designed for the sake of change, it animates too much, and that a font is too small in one place? For what it's worth, the underlying usability really is very well explained and pretty sound in the material (no pun intended) from Google on MD. Eg: http://www.google.com/design/ http://www.google.com/design/ in the top 2 items.
paulojreis 12y ago
I don't know if he was talking about flatter designs, but (IMO) they might fail because the elements are less affordant. We know that affordances are important so, again IMO, the removal of graphical cues that afford action should be approached with care (and empirically validated).
- calinet6 12y ago
  That's one of the success marks of MD I think; it retracts a bit from total flatness and says, ok, even though this is on a screen and will appear flat, how can we give subtle cues that it's actually a thing (material) and you can do stuff with it? And they decided to do it with shadow, animation, and contrast. Maybe there are better ways as well, but the end goal is sound.
MarkMc 12y ago
> I'd love to hear specifics about where you think these designs fail? I actually like the 'flat' look, but one thing I hate is the drop-down menu in Chrome for Android. Here's what I'm talking about: http://goo.gl/41iRZk http://goo.gl/41iRZk When the menu is displayed it takes about half a second to display. Every menu item is...slowly...faded...in...one...after..the...other. Give me Windows 3.1 where you click and the menu displays instantly!!
- rch 12y ago
  Couldn't agree more. And I've started to think that one of the reasons open JS grid and tree controls are so lackluster is that there is too much effort being spent on animations in general. The 'flip and fade in' display options are never useful, but being able to work effectively with high-dimensional, hierarchial data would be. Sencha is closest, but I still have to do a lot of low-level customization to work with dynamically defined columns.
- EC1 12y ago
  I'd love if my iOS 8 worked buttery smooth. No animations. Just click -> open. I hate even a small delay. Every delay is time wasted. I wonder how much time I've cumulatively wasted on UI animations in my life.
- gohrt 12y ago
  Office 2007(?) had that fade-in menu gimmick. Amusing and sad to watch mobile evolution recapitulate desktop design, not skipping over the dumb ideas.
- bennettfeely 12y ago
  And while they are at it, put the dang refresh button back in the url bar. I have never used the speech input button to enter a url into the field. One tap becomes two taps to do something as common as refreshing the page.
- raphael_l 12y ago
  I know it is very difficult for professional users to understand this, but from a design perspective this is actually very well done. These animations are really helpful for people who aren't spending their whole day in front of a computer and rely on cues to help their orientation. I've done usability tests where these "issues" came up, whenever a dropdown or any other form of interaction suddenly popped up and the user had to spend valuable time to re-focus to find out what exactly happened and if this was indeed the right control. Additionally animations are also very useful for transition purposes. Guiding the user from one screen to another can be quite stressful when it's done in an instant and the user has to understand what's happened. This is why Apple's guidelines to transition the screens in a horizontal motion were so damn good, because they allowed users to spatially recognize their "position" in the UI. And I'm glad that the MD guidelines now also state that transitions have to be spatially correct and a screen transition isn't just a window jumping out from the center of the screen. [0] Of course these animations are only temporary and can only help you so much, but they're very good for consumers when they are noticed. And that's all they really are: helpers, not the sole messenger of the meaning of the UI. But of course I understand the plight of delayed interactions. UI lag that is caused by hardware aside, they're really annoying. But I see that more of a problem of customization. The OS should allow to switch off any animation. [0] http://www.google.com/design/spec/animation/meaningful-transitions.html#meaningful-transitions-consistent-choreography http://www.google.com/design/spec/animation/meaningful-trans... "Best practices - Support spatial relationships through consistent motions for incoming and outgoing elements."
petilon 12y ago
Have you read Pogue's review of the new Android? Here's an excerpt from the review: "Unfortunately, there’s so little ornamentation that there are no cues left to tell you when something is tappable. What’s a button, what’s a label, what’s a heading? You won’t know till you try tapping." Full review: https://www.yahoo.com/tech/android-5-0-lollipop-lighter-simpler-and-less-101659697809.html https://www.yahoo.com/tech/android-5-0-lollipop-lighter-simp...
- gohrt 12y ago
  Awkwardly, the "design design" is past that -- the guidelines say to use shadows to create buttons. But the deployed design is using the older design design that didn't realize that.
  - guelo 12y ago
    The guideline has 3 types of buttons one of which is "flat", just text with no decoration. http://www.google.com/design/spec/components/buttons.html http://www.google.com/design/spec/components/buttons.html
- tadfisher 12y ago
  The example he uses is a bit contrived, since everything but the toolbar title is tappable. Does it need raised and colored affordances to signify such? Would this be more or less confusing than what was shipped? And this gem: "In Android of old, you could swipe down from the top of the screen to open a panel of quick settings buttons (brightness, Airplane mode, and so on)." Which tells me the reviewer either has a poor memory or has confused Android with Samsung (which is an honest mistake to make).
  - delecti 12y ago
    That quick panel is indeed in stock android. On tablets, swiping down on the right side of the notification bar opens the quick settings. On phones, swiping left from the notification pulldown switches to the quick settings. Additionally, IIRC swiping down on the right side for the quick settings is default in a number of ROMs.

I don't find this post snarky, but from a usability point of view I'd love to hear specifics about where you think these designs fail?

by davedx 12y ago

I don't find this post snarky, but from a usability point of view I'd love to hear specifics about where you think these designs fail?

sucramb 12y ago

I feel like the same as OP. Change for the sake of change without any real benefits. But with plenty of draw-backs. For example the new Gmail App on Android now uses an almost unreadable font in the overview. It is "designy" but not good for usability - and I still have 100% eye sight. In general I feel like surrounded by the Microsoft paper clip. There is constantly something animating, popping up or popping with strong colors into your eyes. Try to find in all the talk about material design the underlying reasons for usability. There aren't any. To me it feels like the emperor's new cloths. I was about to buy a Nexus 6 but the new Gmail app is a no go for me and I will avoid it as long as possible.

calinet6 12y ago
I mean this in the most respectful way possible, but, your concrete flaws are that you believe it's just designed for the sake of change, it animates too much, and that a font is too small in one place? For what it's worth, the underlying usability really is very well explained and pretty sound in the material (no pun intended) from Google on MD. Eg: http://www.google.com/design/ http://www.google.com/design/ in the top 2 items.

paulojreis 12y ago

I don't know if he was talking about flatter designs, but (IMO) they might fail because the elements are less affordant. We know that affordances are important so, again IMO, the removal of graphical cues that afford action should be approached with care (and empirically validated).

calinet6 12y ago
That's one of the success marks of MD I think; it retracts a bit from total flatness and says, ok, even though this is on a screen and will appear flat, how can we give subtle cues that it's actually a thing (material) and you can do stuff with it? And they decided to do it with shadow, animation, and contrast. Maybe there are better ways as well, but the end goal is sound.

MarkMc 12y ago

> I'd love to hear specifics about where you think these designs fail? I actually like the 'flat' look, but one thing I hate is the drop-down menu in Chrome for Android. Here's what I'm talking about: http://goo.gl/41iRZk http://goo.gl/41iRZk When the menu is displayed it takes about half a second to display. Every menu item is...slowly...faded...in...one...after..the...other. Give me Windows 3.1 where you click and the menu displays instantly!!

rch 12y ago
Couldn't agree more. And I've started to think that one of the reasons open JS grid and tree controls are so lackluster is that there is too much effort being spent on animations in general. The 'flip and fade in' display options are never useful, but being able to work effectively with high-dimensional, hierarchial data would be. Sencha is closest, but I still have to do a lot of low-level customization to work with dynamically defined columns.
EC1 12y ago
I'd love if my iOS 8 worked buttery smooth. No animations. Just click -> open. I hate even a small delay. Every delay is time wasted. I wonder how much time I've cumulatively wasted on UI animations in my life.
gohrt 12y ago
Office 2007(?) had that fade-in menu gimmick. Amusing and sad to watch mobile evolution recapitulate desktop design, not skipping over the dumb ideas.
bennettfeely 12y ago
And while they are at it, put the dang refresh button back in the url bar. I have never used the speech input button to enter a url into the field. One tap becomes two taps to do something as common as refreshing the page.
raphael_l 12y ago
I know it is very difficult for professional users to understand this, but from a design perspective this is actually very well done. These animations are really helpful for people who aren't spending their whole day in front of a computer and rely on cues to help their orientation. I've done usability tests where these "issues" came up, whenever a dropdown or any other form of interaction suddenly popped up and the user had to spend valuable time to re-focus to find out what exactly happened and if this was indeed the right control. Additionally animations are also very useful for transition purposes. Guiding the user from one screen to another can be quite stressful when it's done in an instant and the user has to understand what's happened. This is why Apple's guidelines to transition the screens in a horizontal motion were so damn good, because they allowed users to spatially recognize their "position" in the UI. And I'm glad that the MD guidelines now also state that transitions have to be spatially correct and a screen transition isn't just a window jumping out from the center of the screen. [0] Of course these animations are only temporary and can only help you so much, but they're very good for consumers when they are noticed. And that's all they really are: helpers, not the sole messenger of the meaning of the UI. But of course I understand the plight of delayed interactions. UI lag that is caused by hardware aside, they're really annoying. But I see that more of a problem of customization. The OS should allow to switch off any animation. [0] http://www.google.com/design/spec/animation/meaningful-transitions.html#meaningful-transitions-consistent-choreography http://www.google.com/design/spec/animation/meaningful-trans... "Best practices - Support spatial relationships through consistent motions for incoming and outgoing elements."

petilon 12y ago

Have you read Pogue's review of the new Android? Here's an excerpt from the review: "Unfortunately, there’s so little ornamentation that there are no cues left to tell you when something is tappable. What’s a button, what’s a label, what’s a heading? You won’t know till you try tapping." Full review: https://www.yahoo.com/tech/android-5-0-lollipop-lighter-simpler-and-less-101659697809.html https://www.yahoo.com/tech/android-5-0-lollipop-lighter-simp...

gohrt 12y ago
Awkwardly, the "design design" is past that -- the guidelines say to use shadows to create buttons. But the deployed design is using the older design design that didn't realize that.
- guelo 12y ago
  The guideline has 3 types of buttons one of which is "flat", just text with no decoration. http://www.google.com/design/spec/components/buttons.html http://www.google.com/design/spec/components/buttons.html
tadfisher 12y ago
The example he uses is a bit contrived, since everything but the toolbar title is tappable. Does it need raised and colored affordances to signify such? Would this be more or less confusing than what was shipped? And this gem: "In Android of old, you could swipe down from the top of the screen to open a panel of quick settings buttons (brightness, Airplane mode, and so on)." Which tells me the reviewer either has a poor memory or has confused Android with Samsung (which is an honest mistake to make).
- delecti 12y ago
  That quick panel is indeed in stock android. On tablets, swiping down on the right side of the notification bar opens the quick settings. On phones, swiping left from the notification pulldown switches to the quick settings. Additionally, IIRC swiping down on the right side for the quick settings is default in a number of ROMs.