4 ms·

Maybe they're fleeing as a consequence of culture? Virtually every story I've heard about MBAs in SF can be summed up as "we didn't hire them because of their M

Maybe they're fleeing as a consequence of culture? Virtually every story I've heard about MBAs in SF can be summed up as "we didn't hire them because of their MBA, but rather, in spite of it." I don't know how well-regarded MBAs in SF actually are, but the cultural grapevine suggests there isn't a very high demand for them.

codeonfire 12y ago
There is a culture of groupthink in hiring that mainly benefits people that are doing the hiring. MBA's are bad. Devs that are not social are bad. People with degrees of any kind are bad. Anyone who wouldn't make a good drinking buddy is bad. If you stop and think about who they're optimizing for, it's very dumb yes-man bro friends that don't challenge their decisions or thinking.
- datashovel 12y ago
  I agree that alot of startups have horrible culture. Technical teams can be particularly responsible for it if not kept in check. But I would argue that teams configured of that kind of personality generally won't get past the first round of funding. But having worked with / for many startups in my career, my intuition tells me that competent / grounded MBAs bring little to the table when compared to competent / grounded technical folks.
  - datashovel 12y ago
    Downvote? Sorry for not sugar-coating it. I thought this discussion was about why MBAs seem to be trending away from SF, and back toward finance.
- analog31 12y ago
  While I upvoted you, on the flip side, I've noticed that MBAs tend to be hired by other MBAs. This is certainly the pattern at the company where I work. If you highlight the MBAs on the org chart, they will tend to be clustered. Folks also decide to pursue an MBA when they see that the entire ladder above them is populated by MBAs. It could be that MBAs have something that the rest of us don't know we need, or that we don't know how to hire and manage an MBA.
  - datashovel 12y ago
    I've always seen MBAs as filling positions that make it possible to grow your organization. A sort of organizational glue. My perspective is by the nature of their roles they aren't meant to play a pivotal role. So perhaps for the time being fewer MBAs means less growth in the sector. However, I envision a future where the positions MBAs fill will be some of the first ones automated. My perspective is that MBAs are a dying breed, and over time it will only become more evident.
    - analog31 12y ago
      I don't want to sound too cynical here, but just the right amount of cynical: I work in a large organization that has layer upon layer of hierarchy. To me, middle management seems like an information processing task: Gathering, organizing, analyzing, and reporting up and down the ladder. The language of management is a COmmon, Business-Oriented Language. ;-)
foobarqux 12y ago
> cultural grapevine suggests there isn't a very high demand for them. Publicly observable facts say otherwise. Go look at BizOps at the major tech companies, including YC alumni like Dropbox and Stripe: They are filled with MBAs and former consultants and bankers ("MBA-types"). They are usually paid better than the working slobs, have better working conditions and have better career trajectories.

codeonfire 12y ago

There is a culture of groupthink in hiring that mainly benefits people that are doing the hiring. MBA's are bad. Devs that are not social are bad. People with degrees of any kind are bad. Anyone who wouldn't make a good drinking buddy is bad. If you stop and think about who they're optimizing for, it's very dumb yes-man bro friends that don't challenge their decisions or thinking.

datashovel 12y ago
I agree that alot of startups have horrible culture. Technical teams can be particularly responsible for it if not kept in check. But I would argue that teams configured of that kind of personality generally won't get past the first round of funding. But having worked with / for many startups in my career, my intuition tells me that competent / grounded MBAs bring little to the table when compared to competent / grounded technical folks.
- datashovel 12y ago
  Downvote? Sorry for not sugar-coating it. I thought this discussion was about why MBAs seem to be trending away from SF, and back toward finance.
analog31 12y ago
While I upvoted you, on the flip side, I've noticed that MBAs tend to be hired by other MBAs. This is certainly the pattern at the company where I work. If you highlight the MBAs on the org chart, they will tend to be clustered. Folks also decide to pursue an MBA when they see that the entire ladder above them is populated by MBAs. It could be that MBAs have something that the rest of us don't know we need, or that we don't know how to hire and manage an MBA.
- datashovel 12y ago
  I've always seen MBAs as filling positions that make it possible to grow your organization. A sort of organizational glue. My perspective is by the nature of their roles they aren't meant to play a pivotal role. So perhaps for the time being fewer MBAs means less growth in the sector. However, I envision a future where the positions MBAs fill will be some of the first ones automated. My perspective is that MBAs are a dying breed, and over time it will only become more evident.
  - analog31 12y ago
    I don't want to sound too cynical here, but just the right amount of cynical: I work in a large organization that has layer upon layer of hierarchy. To me, middle management seems like an information processing task: Gathering, organizing, analyzing, and reporting up and down the ladder. The language of management is a COmmon, Business-Oriented Language. ;-)

foobarqux 12y ago

> cultural grapevine suggests there isn't a very high demand for them. Publicly observable facts say otherwise. Go look at BizOps at the major tech companies, including YC alumni like Dropbox and Stripe: They are filled with MBAs and former consultants and bankers ("MBA-types"). They are usually paid better than the working slobs, have better working conditions and have better career trajectories.