4 ms·

Cable TV boxes become 2nd biggest energy users in many homes

29 points by swift 12y ago

greenyoda 12y ago
"Cheryl Williamsen, a Los Alamitos architect, has three of the boxes leased from her cable provider in her home, but she had no idea how much power they consumed until recently, when she saw a rating on the back for as much as 500 watts — about the same as a washing machine." It just makes no sense for cable box electronics to draw 500 watts. I wonder if the LA Times fact-checked this claim. Maybe the box had a switched outlet into which a TV could be plugged? And it's contradicted by this quote in the very next sentence: "A set-top cable box with a digital recorder can consume as much as 35 watts of power."
- pmorici 12y ago
  I could see a clunky old Tivo style DVR consuming that much.
  - userbinator 12y ago
    500W is in the range of a mid-to-high-end PC with an overclocked CPU and GPU running at full load; I doubt a DVR would ever need that much processing power.
- imgabe 12y ago
  A power supply rated for 500 watts doesn't mean the device draws 500 watts all the time. Most electronics don't draw anywhere near their rated input during normal use.
  - revelation 12y ago
    A power supply rated for 500 watts needs active cooling. I don't think set-top boxes come with fans yet. (Not to mention that components consuming 500 watts need cooling..)
    - mcpherrinm 12y ago
      I have seen (and thus heard!) set top boxes with fans. They are usually pretty quiet, but they're there.
  - deleted 12y ago
    [deleted]
- _red 12y ago
  My ATT Uverse uses about 30 watts. I personally don't believe that a set top box could use 500 watts (thats more than 4A draw - probably more than most 2U rack servers loaded with CPU's and Hard Drives).
tomrod 12y ago
How bad is Roku?
- hsckid 12y ago
  Roku's power input is rated 12V and 1A [https://www.roku.com/products/roku-3 https://www.roku.com/products/roku-3]. This is maximum draw of 12W at any given time.
  - tomrod 12y ago
    Makes sense. Thanks for letting me know!
  - chrismeller 12y ago
    Keep in mind that that's the maximum input while it's in use... I don't think there's any way to figure out how much it would use when off without plugging it into a kill-a-watt.
- quaffapint 12y ago
  I know my WDTV was 5W when I measured it with the KaW and the interesting thing was it didn't really change much when I was watching something with it.
- ryanwanger 12y ago
  I've got a Roku HD (model 2500X) and just did some measurements: Starting up: 3.5W Sitting idly on menu screen: 3.15W Sitting idly on screen saver: 3.3W Streaming Arrested Development: 3.45W Also worth noting that when not in use, it goes to screen saver mode. It never actually powers down at all. So basically, it uses the same amount no matter what you're doing with it. And really ironic that the screen saver uses more power than the menu screen. I guess the appearance of saving power is more important?
mschuster91 12y ago
This is why I'm happy for living in the EU. While developing a smart-TV-controller appliance, I ended up researching CE and other requirements which have to be met... and some of these actually set maximum allowed standby power consumption! I bet that the US market doesn't have anything remotely similar (and that TTIP and friends will allow US companies to sell their shit in EU without adhering to our rules!)
- Palomides 12y ago
  actually we have the EPA's Energy Star certification system, which a lot of products do try for.
  - mschuster91 12y ago
    Yeah but iirc this is not mandatory, so if you're a cable provider you don't need Energy* as a marketing plus
    - maxerickson 12y ago
      It doesn't apply to STBs, but there are mandatory standards for many appliance categories: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Appliance_Energy_Conservation_Act http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Appliance_Energy_Conse... http://energy.gov/node/773531/index.html http://energy.gov/node/773531/index.html That is going to meet some definitions of "remotely similar" (and fail others). Energy Star usually benchmarks off of those standards. There are also adjustments, so Energy Star products from some time ago might not meet current mandatory standards (but I haven't looked to find an actual case of this, just pointing out that it could be).
- wmf 12y ago
  Looks like there's a voluntary standard in the US: http://www.nytimes.com/2013/12/24/business/media/agreement-reached-to-cut-power-use-by-cable-devices.html http://www.nytimes.com/2013/12/24/business/media/agreement-r...
imgabe 12y ago
> The devices use nearly as much power turned off as they do when they are turned on. Well, the whole point of a DVR is that it does things when you're not there. If you want it to record shows after you've turned it "off", then it can't really be "off" can it?
- mschuster91 12y ago
  It can, just program a RTC to raise an interrupt on a specified wake time and the OS shuts down the CPU once recording is done.
  - vegedor 12y ago
    well, don't forget to send the cpu to sleep before waiting for the interrupt as well
- HeyLaughingBoy 12y ago
  No, it can't be off, but good design would have it drawing a tiny fraction of the "on" current while on standby. Evidently power consumption wasn't one of the important design requirements.
- cardiffspaceman 12y ago
  EPG (electronic program guide) aquisition can work using low-bandwidth methods if the box can stay on all the time. This low-bandwidth method could be a broadcast to all boxes constantly. So if your goal is a two-week EPG the box has to stay on for quite a while until it has seen all two weeks' data, and to process that you need to store it on the HDD. Such a box is going to be running close to its normal power requirement while doing these things.
steven2012 12y ago
In the last couple of years, I've turned into a complete energy fascist, especially after getting my own home and being eaten alive by my first few PGE bills. Ever since then, I converted to LED lights for everything, and bought a Kill-A-Watt meter to figure out where the biggest hogs were. I even selected components for my desktop based on energy efficiency (90+% efficient power supply, low wattage CPU, graphics card, etc). I also had a dual CPU Xeon processor VMWare server that was using 200W idle, so I shut that down and replaced it with a couple of Intel NUCs. I figure that the Xeon server was costing me about $50/month in electricity alone, and could have easily been replaced by a couple of cloud VMs had I realized sooner. Also, it turned out that my 2005 LCD tv and my PS3 together drew something like 400W when on. Needless to say I haven't turned on my PS3 in a while, and I've been eyeing a Roku for whenever I do want to watch Amazon Video. I've cut my energy usage from 700 kWh per month to just over 300 kWh, and I haven't noticed any difference whatsoever in my lifestyle. I just cut out the wasteful electricity usage, and I now have my LED lights programmed to be on almost all night long around the house, turning off late a night automatically. I'm seriously toying with the idea of getting an electric car, since I don't think it would push me into Tier 3 even if I was recharging every night.
- revelation 12y ago
  Notice that 300kWh/month still comes out to roughly 400 watts used at any given moment. Can you account for them?
  - mikeytown2 12y ago
    The fridge would be my guess
    - maxerickson 12y ago
      Heating or AC (or both) are more likely. With modern refrigerators, hot water could also be a bigger fraction.
      - steven2012 12y ago
chrismeller 12y ago
There are no stats in this article to justify the claim that it's the 2nd largest consumer in your home. The architect seeing the 500 watt rating on the back of one is immediately followed by "A set-top cable box with a digital recorder can consume as much as 35 watts of power". In fact, at 35 watts, according to this chart[1] it wouldn't even come close to being the second largest consumer. [1]: https://www.efficiencyvermont.com/For-My-Home/ways-to-save-and-rebates/Appliances/Refrigerators/General-Info/Electric-Usage-Chart https://www.efficiencyvermont.com/For-My-Home/ways-to-save-a...
freshyill 12y ago
We're about ready to cut the cord, and I've been suspecting our two Dish boxes are huge hogs anyway. We recently got the first results of an audit we signed up for through our provider (Pepco), and we were shocked to see that our usage is well beyond the average. We were pretty shocked considering we have 100% Compact fluorescent bulbs, very new appliances, and we're generally very conscious of our usage. Our dryer is natural gas, as is our furnace and oven. Our central AC unit is ancient, but it was a mild summer and we set it to not be as cool during the day. The only computer on during the day is a Mac mini. We're convinced something isn't right. I think a kill-a-watt will be a near-future purchase.
stretchwithme 12y ago
One more reason for the local community to own the last mile: more control over such devices.

29 points by swift 12y ago

"Cheryl Williamsen, a Los Alamitos architect, has three of the boxes leased from her cable provider in her home, but she had no idea how much power they consumed until recently, when she saw a rating on the back for as much as 500 watts — about the same as a washing machine." It just makes no sense for cable box electronics to draw 500 watts. I wonder if the LA Times fact-checked this claim. Maybe the box had a switched outlet into which a TV could be plugged? And it's contradicted by this quote in the very next sentence: "A set-top cable box with a digital recorder can consume as much as 35 watts of power."

pmorici 12y ago
I could see a clunky old Tivo style DVR consuming that much.
- userbinator 12y ago
  500W is in the range of a mid-to-high-end PC with an overclocked CPU and GPU running at full load; I doubt a DVR would ever need that much processing power.
imgabe 12y ago
A power supply rated for 500 watts doesn't mean the device draws 500 watts all the time. Most electronics don't draw anywhere near their rated input during normal use.
- revelation 12y ago
  A power supply rated for 500 watts needs active cooling. I don't think set-top boxes come with fans yet. (Not to mention that components consuming 500 watts need cooling..)
  - mcpherrinm 12y ago
    I have seen (and thus heard!) set top boxes with fans. They are usually pretty quiet, but they're there.
- deleted 12y ago
  [deleted]
_red 12y ago
My ATT Uverse uses about 30 watts. I personally don't believe that a set top box could use 500 watts (thats more than 4A draw - probably more than most 2U rack servers loaded with CPU's and Hard Drives).

tomrod 12y ago

How bad is Roku?

hsckid 12y ago
Roku's power input is rated 12V and 1A [https://www.roku.com/products/roku-3 https://www.roku.com/products/roku-3]. This is maximum draw of 12W at any given time.
- tomrod 12y ago
  Makes sense. Thanks for letting me know!
- chrismeller 12y ago
  Keep in mind that that's the maximum input while it's in use... I don't think there's any way to figure out how much it would use when off without plugging it into a kill-a-watt.
quaffapint 12y ago
I know my WDTV was 5W when I measured it with the KaW and the interesting thing was it didn't really change much when I was watching something with it.
ryanwanger 12y ago
I've got a Roku HD (model 2500X) and just did some measurements: Starting up: 3.5W Sitting idly on menu screen: 3.15W Sitting idly on screen saver: 3.3W Streaming Arrested Development: 3.45W Also worth noting that when not in use, it goes to screen saver mode. It never actually powers down at all. So basically, it uses the same amount no matter what you're doing with it. And really ironic that the screen saver uses more power than the menu screen. I guess the appearance of saving power is more important?

mschuster91 12y ago

This is why I'm happy for living in the EU. While developing a smart-TV-controller appliance, I ended up researching CE and other requirements which have to be met... and some of these actually set maximum allowed standby power consumption! I bet that the US market doesn't have anything remotely similar (and that TTIP and friends will allow US companies to sell their shit in EU without adhering to our rules!)

Palomides 12y ago
actually we have the EPA's Energy Star certification system, which a lot of products do try for.
- mschuster91 12y ago
  Yeah but iirc this is not mandatory, so if you're a cable provider you don't need Energy* as a marketing plus
  - maxerickson 12y ago
    It doesn't apply to STBs, but there are mandatory standards for many appliance categories: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Appliance_Energy_Conservation_Act http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Appliance_Energy_Conse... http://energy.gov/node/773531/index.html http://energy.gov/node/773531/index.html That is going to meet some definitions of "remotely similar" (and fail others). Energy Star usually benchmarks off of those standards. There are also adjustments, so Energy Star products from some time ago might not meet current mandatory standards (but I haven't looked to find an actual case of this, just pointing out that it could be).
wmf 12y ago
Looks like there's a voluntary standard in the US: http://www.nytimes.com/2013/12/24/business/media/agreement-reached-to-cut-power-use-by-cable-devices.html http://www.nytimes.com/2013/12/24/business/media/agreement-r...

imgabe 12y ago

> The devices use nearly as much power turned off as they do when they are turned on. Well, the whole point of a DVR is that it does things when you're not there. If you want it to record shows after you've turned it "off", then it can't really be "off" can it?

mschuster91 12y ago
It can, just program a RTC to raise an interrupt on a specified wake time and the OS shuts down the CPU once recording is done.
- vegedor 12y ago
  well, don't forget to send the cpu to sleep before waiting for the interrupt as well
HeyLaughingBoy 12y ago
No, it can't be off, but good design would have it drawing a tiny fraction of the "on" current while on standby. Evidently power consumption wasn't one of the important design requirements.
cardiffspaceman 12y ago
EPG (electronic program guide) aquisition can work using low-bandwidth methods if the box can stay on all the time. This low-bandwidth method could be a broadcast to all boxes constantly. So if your goal is a two-week EPG the box has to stay on for quite a while until it has seen all two weeks' data, and to process that you need to store it on the HDD. Such a box is going to be running close to its normal power requirement while doing these things.

steven2012 12y ago

In the last couple of years, I've turned into a complete energy fascist, especially after getting my own home and being eaten alive by my first few PGE bills. Ever since then, I converted to LED lights for everything, and bought a Kill-A-Watt meter to figure out where the biggest hogs were. I even selected components for my desktop based on energy efficiency (90+% efficient power supply, low wattage CPU, graphics card, etc). I also had a dual CPU Xeon processor VMWare server that was using 200W idle, so I shut that down and replaced it with a couple of Intel NUCs. I figure that the Xeon server was costing me about $50/month in electricity alone, and could have easily been replaced by a couple of cloud VMs had I realized sooner. Also, it turned out that my 2005 LCD tv and my PS3 together drew something like 400W when on. Needless to say I haven't turned on my PS3 in a while, and I've been eyeing a Roku for whenever I do want to watch Amazon Video. I've cut my energy usage from 700 kWh per month to just over 300 kWh, and I haven't noticed any difference whatsoever in my lifestyle. I just cut out the wasteful electricity usage, and I now have my LED lights programmed to be on almost all night long around the house, turning off late a night automatically. I'm seriously toying with the idea of getting an electric car, since I don't think it would push me into Tier 3 even if I was recharging every night.

revelation 12y ago
Notice that 300kWh/month still comes out to roughly 400 watts used at any given moment. Can you account for them?
- mikeytown2 12y ago
  The fridge would be my guess
  - maxerickson 12y ago
    Heating or AC (or both) are more likely. With modern refrigerators, hot water could also be a bigger fraction.
    - steven2012 12y ago

chrismeller 12y ago

There are no stats in this article to justify the claim that it's the 2nd largest consumer in your home. The architect seeing the 500 watt rating on the back of one is immediately followed by "A set-top cable box with a digital recorder can consume as much as 35 watts of power". In fact, at 35 watts, according to this chart[1] it wouldn't even come close to being the second largest consumer. [1]: https://www.efficiencyvermont.com/For-My-Home/ways-to-save-and-rebates/Appliances/Refrigerators/General-Info/Electric-Usage-Chart https://www.efficiencyvermont.com/For-My-Home/ways-to-save-a...

freshyill 12y ago

We're about ready to cut the cord, and I've been suspecting our two Dish boxes are huge hogs anyway. We recently got the first results of an audit we signed up for through our provider (Pepco), and we were shocked to see that our usage is well beyond the average. We were pretty shocked considering we have 100% Compact fluorescent bulbs, very new appliances, and we're generally very conscious of our usage. Our dryer is natural gas, as is our furnace and oven. Our central AC unit is ancient, but it was a mild summer and we set it to not be as cool during the day. The only computer on during the day is a Mac mini. We're convinced something isn't right. I think a kill-a-watt will be a near-future purchase.

stretchwithme 12y ago

One more reason for the local community to own the last mile: more control over such devices.