4 ms·

Oh please, here we go again. Stop advocating your love for that 30 year-old piece of software. Please. Stop it. You don't hear ME expressing my love for Eclipse

by akie 17y ago

Oh please, here we go again. Stop advocating your love for that 30 year-old piece of software. Please. Stop it. You don't hear ME expressing my love for Eclipse on a daily basis, now do you? Seems like you have some convincing to do? Plus, I'm not buying it. If it's so great, why do you even have to market it? Wouldn't it just sell itself? But no. Instead we get these "VI is great" vs "Emacs is better" discussions every-f*cking-time. And I've had it. Just use your old, old, old piece of software, be happy about, and stop trying to convince me.

deleted 17y ago
[deleted]
akie 17y ago
Ok, I would have expected to be downvoted. Dissent on VI vs Emacs is not tolerated among Computer Scientist (and I'm one myself).
- yan 17y ago
  Nope, I don't think the downvoting came from dissent, it came from you shitting on other people contributing helpful technical documentation while adding no value of your own.
rudenoise 17y ago
Yes Vim was started a long time ago (1991), that means that it has had that bit longer to refine. Eclipse is great too, and people do say so. Add Vim to Eclipse and you can have the best of both.
skolor 17y ago
I believe the reason it comes up so often is because the depth of the software. I'm just starting, but from what I have been told there is a ton of things to learn, and its hard to know where to go after the first tutorial or two.
bmj 17y ago
If it's so great, why do you even have to market it? That's kinda silly. That's like saying "why does Apple spend jillions of dollars marketing the iPhone if it's so great?" Some people genuinely don't know about [pick your editor], and some people like their tools so much, they like to tell you about them. Isn't that the whole point of blogs, anyway?
- WilliamLP 17y ago
  > "why does Apple spend jillions of dollars marketing the iPhone if it's so great?" Because it leads to massive profit. I don't think it's pure altruism motivated by a desire to give better user experiences.
  - bmj 17y ago
    It's not just about the money, though. How is free/open source supposed to gain traction, if not by people saying "hey, this is good!" If no one "markets" a piece of software, how you know about? How did _you_ find out about the tools you use?
    - WilliamLP 17y ago
      Agreed, but I was just pointing out a clear non-sequitur in the parent post. People should use logic when making a point.
evilbit 17y ago
i, too, am a very happy long time (13+ years) vi/vim user. if you haven't ever used a powerful keyboard-only text editor such as vim or emacs, you simply have no idea what you've been missing. quit being a curmudgeon. this is one happy human sharing something they love with others. if you don't want any of it, just keep moving. your negativity does not advance the human condition.
- WilliamLP 17y ago
  Or is it that if you spend 13+ years with any tool, you get very intimate and familiar with it, learn to appreciate its strengths, and don't have an objective view anymore as to the weaknesses. (Especially weaknesses during the first year when you weren't a master.) I guess to compare, you'd have to have used an IDE with GUI for 13 years too? I bet you'd be very effective that way too.
  - mhansen 17y ago
    If you spend that long with a tool, you certainly push out and find the weaknesses
yan 17y ago
Don't like it? Don't use it. Others, who basically edit text for a living, like to explore their options. You don't rant at every ad you see, do you?
jodrellblank 17y ago
Why are you being so ageist? Old software is the stuff that's grizzled and survived all comers. It's the stuff that people like enough to drag along with them into the future porting to new architectures, operating systems, windowing systems as they go. Not because some company wants to push it but just because it really is that good. If it's so great, why do you even have to market it? Wouldn't it just sell itself? Countering this is a common meme in HN articles - that you can't just write some polished software in a room somewhere and expect people to beat a path to your door for it.

by akie 17y ago

deleted 17y ago

[deleted]

akie 17y ago

Ok, I would have expected to be downvoted. Dissent on VI vs Emacs is not tolerated among Computer Scientist (and I'm one myself).

yan 17y ago
Nope, I don't think the downvoting came from dissent, it came from you shitting on other people contributing helpful technical documentation while adding no value of your own.

rudenoise 17y ago

Yes Vim was started a long time ago (1991), that means that it has had that bit longer to refine. Eclipse is great too, and people do say so. Add Vim to Eclipse and you can have the best of both.

skolor 17y ago

I believe the reason it comes up so often is because the depth of the software. I'm just starting, but from what I have been told there is a ton of things to learn, and its hard to know where to go after the first tutorial or two.

bmj 17y ago

If it's so great, why do you even have to market it? That's kinda silly. That's like saying "why does Apple spend jillions of dollars marketing the iPhone if it's so great?" Some people genuinely don't know about [pick your editor], and some people like their tools so much, they like to tell you about them. Isn't that the whole point of blogs, anyway?

WilliamLP 17y ago
> "why does Apple spend jillions of dollars marketing the iPhone if it's so great?" Because it leads to massive profit. I don't think it's pure altruism motivated by a desire to give better user experiences.
- bmj 17y ago
  It's not just about the money, though. How is free/open source supposed to gain traction, if not by people saying "hey, this is good!" If no one "markets" a piece of software, how you know about? How did _you_ find out about the tools you use?
  - WilliamLP 17y ago
    Agreed, but I was just pointing out a clear non-sequitur in the parent post. People should use logic when making a point.

evilbit 17y ago

i, too, am a very happy long time (13+ years) vi/vim user. if you haven't ever used a powerful keyboard-only text editor such as vim or emacs, you simply have no idea what you've been missing. quit being a curmudgeon. this is one happy human sharing something they love with others. if you don't want any of it, just keep moving. your negativity does not advance the human condition.

WilliamLP 17y ago
Or is it that if you spend 13+ years with any tool, you get very intimate and familiar with it, learn to appreciate its strengths, and don't have an objective view anymore as to the weaknesses. (Especially weaknesses during the first year when you weren't a master.) I guess to compare, you'd have to have used an IDE with GUI for 13 years too? I bet you'd be very effective that way too.
- mhansen 17y ago
  If you spend that long with a tool, you certainly push out and find the weaknesses

yan 17y ago

Don't like it? Don't use it. Others, who basically edit text for a living, like to explore their options. You don't rant at every ad you see, do you?

jodrellblank 17y ago

Why are you being so ageist? Old software is the stuff that's grizzled and survived all comers. It's the stuff that people like enough to drag along with them into the future porting to new architectures, operating systems, windowing systems as they go. Not because some company wants to push it but just because it really is that good. If it's so great, why do you even have to market it? Wouldn't it just sell itself? Countering this is a common meme in HN articles - that you can't just write some polished software in a room somewhere and expect people to beat a path to your door for it.