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This was a painful read. He says he "doesn't want to be educated about bitcoin" because "he's heard all the arguments", while at the same time claiming it's a

This was a painful read. He says he "doesn't want to be educated about bitcoin" because "he's heard all the arguments", while at the same time claiming it's a "terrible currency (or not a currency at all)" without any further reasoning. This poor guy needs to be educated if he thinks that avoiding taxes, regulations, and credit card fees are the only applications. Common decency dictates that if you openly state you are unwilling to learn about something, you should refrain from posting opinionated articles about that thing.

cbsmith 12y ago
> This poor guy needs to be educated if he thinks that avoiding taxes, regulations, and credit card fees are the only applications. I think he very clearly understands all the applications. The point is that _for his case_ it doesn't provide any value, and he believes in a lot of cases its drawbacks outweigh its advantages (which is an entirely arguably point). > Common decency dictates that if you openly state you are unwilling to learn about something, you should refrain from posting opinionated articles about that thing. Again, I think you misread the article. It isn't that he is unwilling to learn something. He's learned a great deal and concluded that it makes his life more difficult. More importantly, he's pointed out a significant problem with it: there are a lot of things that can happen with Bitcoin that would otherwise be prevented and you'd want them to be prevented.
- firepacket 12y ago
  > I think he very clearly understands all the applications. Really? And what are you basing that opinion off of exactly? The only applications he mentions in his post relate to taxes and credit card fees. If he had any understanding of the other uses like multiparty transactions, timestamping, identity management, voting, derivatives, and trustfree contracts, then he failed to say anything to convey that awareness in his writing. > Again, I think you misread the article. It isn't that he is unwilling to learn something. He's learned a great deal and concluded that it makes his life more difficult. I didn't misread anything. Rather, he miswrote by conflating his opinions of a single bitcoin service with the entire underlying protocol.
  - cbsmith 12y ago
    > If he had any understanding of the other uses like multiparty transactions, timestamping, identity management, voting, derivatives, and trustfree contracts, then he failed to say anything to convey that awareness in his writing. He wrote nothing about whether he requires oxygen to live, but I'll wager with you he needs it. He spoke negatively of Bitcoin as a currency (and currencies aren't used for much of what you describe), but he highlighted a number of aspects of Bitcoin that he thought were useful and where he expecting to see it having a huge, innovative impact. He didn't make a laundry list of everything awesome one might be able to do with Bitcoin, but given that his essay was about the future of payments, you can see where perhaps speaking of its use for voting might have resulted in the essay becoming meandering and without focus... > I didn't misread anything. Trust me, you did. > Rather, he miswrote by conflating his opinions of a single bitcoin service with the entire underlying protocol. No he didn't. Actually, he hardly got two paragraphs in before he said, "I did not actually have anything against Bitcoin in this particular case." So no, he's quite aware that his issues with "a single bitcoin service" are removed from the underlying protocol.
    - firepacket 12y ago
      > He wrote nothing about whether he requires oxygen to live, but I'll wager with you he needs it. So you think understanding bitcoin applications is obvious as breathing oxygen? Sounds to me like you're making baseless assumptions. > He spoke negatively of Bitcoin as a currency Yes he did, and he didn't mention why. It was just a page full of backhanded jabs and insults towards bitcoin with zero reasoning to support it. Doesn't strike me as someone who understands it at all, quite the contrary. > he highlighted a number of aspects of Bitcoin that he thought were useful and where he expecting to see it having a huge, innovative impact. Inter-bank asset exchange? If that's where he thinks the major innovation lies, he clearly and severely lacks understanding of potential applications. > Trust me, you did. Ok, pal. > So no, he's quite aware that his issues with "a single bitcoin service" are removed from the underlying protocol. If he has regulatory issues with accepting small gifts, or if he doesn't like the methodology of a particular bitcoin service, that has absolutely nothing to do with bitcoin as a currency. How is making statements like "bitcoin is a terrible currency" without including any actual reasoning anything but pure ignorance?
Nursie 12y ago
Perhaps he doesn't want to be educated about Bitcoin because he already gets it and the last thing he wants is to have to endure more proselytising from well-meaning but ultimately quite predictable evangelists.

cbsmith 12y ago

> This poor guy needs to be educated if he thinks that avoiding taxes, regulations, and credit card fees are the only applications. I think he very clearly understands all the applications. The point is that _for his case_ it doesn't provide any value, and he believes in a lot of cases its drawbacks outweigh its advantages (which is an entirely arguably point). > Common decency dictates that if you openly state you are unwilling to learn about something, you should refrain from posting opinionated articles about that thing. Again, I think you misread the article. It isn't that he is unwilling to learn something. He's learned a great deal and concluded that it makes his life more difficult. More importantly, he's pointed out a significant problem with it: there are a lot of things that can happen with Bitcoin that would otherwise be prevented and you'd want them to be prevented.

firepacket 12y ago
> I think he very clearly understands all the applications. Really? And what are you basing that opinion off of exactly? The only applications he mentions in his post relate to taxes and credit card fees. If he had any understanding of the other uses like multiparty transactions, timestamping, identity management, voting, derivatives, and trustfree contracts, then he failed to say anything to convey that awareness in his writing. > Again, I think you misread the article. It isn't that he is unwilling to learn something. He's learned a great deal and concluded that it makes his life more difficult. I didn't misread anything. Rather, he miswrote by conflating his opinions of a single bitcoin service with the entire underlying protocol.
- cbsmith 12y ago
  > If he had any understanding of the other uses like multiparty transactions, timestamping, identity management, voting, derivatives, and trustfree contracts, then he failed to say anything to convey that awareness in his writing. He wrote nothing about whether he requires oxygen to live, but I'll wager with you he needs it. He spoke negatively of Bitcoin as a currency (and currencies aren't used for much of what you describe), but he highlighted a number of aspects of Bitcoin that he thought were useful and where he expecting to see it having a huge, innovative impact. He didn't make a laundry list of everything awesome one might be able to do with Bitcoin, but given that his essay was about the future of payments, you can see where perhaps speaking of its use for voting might have resulted in the essay becoming meandering and without focus... > I didn't misread anything. Trust me, you did. > Rather, he miswrote by conflating his opinions of a single bitcoin service with the entire underlying protocol. No he didn't. Actually, he hardly got two paragraphs in before he said, "I did not actually have anything against Bitcoin in this particular case." So no, he's quite aware that his issues with "a single bitcoin service" are removed from the underlying protocol.
  - firepacket 12y ago
    > He wrote nothing about whether he requires oxygen to live, but I'll wager with you he needs it. So you think understanding bitcoin applications is obvious as breathing oxygen? Sounds to me like you're making baseless assumptions. > He spoke negatively of Bitcoin as a currency Yes he did, and he didn't mention why. It was just a page full of backhanded jabs and insults towards bitcoin with zero reasoning to support it. Doesn't strike me as someone who understands it at all, quite the contrary. > he highlighted a number of aspects of Bitcoin that he thought were useful and where he expecting to see it having a huge, innovative impact. Inter-bank asset exchange? If that's where he thinks the major innovation lies, he clearly and severely lacks understanding of potential applications. > Trust me, you did. Ok, pal. > So no, he's quite aware that his issues with "a single bitcoin service" are removed from the underlying protocol. If he has regulatory issues with accepting small gifts, or if he doesn't like the methodology of a particular bitcoin service, that has absolutely nothing to do with bitcoin as a currency. How is making statements like "bitcoin is a terrible currency" without including any actual reasoning anything but pure ignorance?

Nursie 12y ago

Perhaps he doesn't want to be educated about Bitcoin because he already gets it and the last thing he wants is to have to endure more proselytising from well-meaning but ultimately quite predictable evangelists.