4 ms·

It's not funding. It's the relative power of unions. In California, a cop costs $200k a year, when pensions and health care are factored in.

raldi 12y ago
How much does one cost in NYC?
- ende 12y ago
  How much ya got?
  - ende 12y ago
    Downvoting comments like that is pointless and should be banned.
  - ende 12y ago
    Downvoting comments like that is pointless and should be banned.
  - ende 12y ago
    Downvoting comments like that is pointless and should be banned.
  - ende 12y ago
    Downvoting comments like that is pointless and should be banned.
WildUtah 12y ago
That's not true at all. California cops can make $200k a year cash just with overtime and incentives. Including pension schemes and other benefits, it's common for mid-career CA cops to make upwards of $500k. Consider that 25 year CHP officers can collect lifetime pensions at the highest pay, including overtime accumulated from previous years and cashed out. At a US inflation adjusted bond discount rate of 0-1% typical over the past decade and usual life expectancy tables, that adds up to 1.5-3 extra years of pay in pension benefits for each year of service. That's computed according to what you'd have to put into a 401(k) to pay for the pension; the state of California is putting somewhat less into CalPERS and hoping to get bailed out by private sector taxpayers or the Federal Government someday. (CA isn't doing as badly as MA or IL or some others on pension funding, though) NYC is paying much more rationally and budgeting better than other big city and coastal governments which is one reason there are enough cops there to keep order.
- GabrielF00 12y ago
  >Including pension schemes and other benefits, it's common for mid-career CA cops to make upwards of $500k. Could you provide a source for this? I checked the salary database for the city and county of San Francisco and, while there were 2099 people in the police department with total pay over $100,000, nobody had total pay of $500,000 - and the maximum was $345,000. http://www.sfgate.com/news/databases/?appSession=458479105660989&RecordID=&PageID=2&PrevPageID=3&cpipage=3&CPISortType=&CPIorderBy= http://www.sfgate.com/news/databases/?appSession=45847910566...
  - ssully 12y ago
    Maybe from working side jobs? Most police departments offer a ton of various side jobs. Be it renting out officers to basically do security for various businesses, or working at understaffed or undesirable locations. These jobs usually pay really well, sometimes between 60-80 dollars an hour. I have no clue if this extra pay would be shown in city salary databases, but I wouldn't be surprised if not.
  - WildUtah 12y ago
    Base salaries are often only $100k but then generous vacation compensation, incentives, 2x and 3x overtime, and such bring it close to $200k. Gold plated health and other benefits often bring current compensation for CA cops (CHP, BART, SF, &c) over $200k. Then generous pensions kick in. CA cops and firemen usually get full pensions after 20-25 years but the pension is paid not just on salary but a multiple of final year vacation and comp time. Pensions can be 2x-3.5x final 'base' salary and higher than any overtime adjusted salary. CalPERS is hoping for 5% above inflation returns but for a decade has made about 1%. At 1%, you essentially have to save or take on future liability for the whole pension during working life. No private employer provides these benefits after 20-25 years or on this basis at all because it would mean bankruptcy. Public finance allows it so the total compensation of a cop getting $200k in salary, adjustments, and benefits is often over $500k all in. Some of that will be the bankruptcy and bailout. Google "Vallejo firefighter bankruptcy" for details of CA's future public safety service.
- orbifold 12y ago
puredemo 12y ago
public unions are a scam. Who exactly are you negotiating against? Oh yeah, the taxpayer.
sthomas1618 12y ago
I'm not sure about that. I don't know about SF, but in many other CA cities, they have plenty of positions open, but are having trouble finding qualified candidates. Being in law enforcement is not very appealing.

raldi 12y ago

How much does one cost in NYC?

ende 12y ago
How much ya got?
- ende 12y ago
  Downvoting comments like that is pointless and should be banned.
- ende 12y ago
  Downvoting comments like that is pointless and should be banned.
- ende 12y ago
  Downvoting comments like that is pointless and should be banned.
- ende 12y ago
  Downvoting comments like that is pointless and should be banned.

WildUtah 12y ago

That's not true at all. California cops can make $200k a year cash just with overtime and incentives. Including pension schemes and other benefits, it's common for mid-career CA cops to make upwards of $500k. Consider that 25 year CHP officers can collect lifetime pensions at the highest pay, including overtime accumulated from previous years and cashed out. At a US inflation adjusted bond discount rate of 0-1% typical over the past decade and usual life expectancy tables, that adds up to 1.5-3 extra years of pay in pension benefits for each year of service. That's computed according to what you'd have to put into a 401(k) to pay for the pension; the state of California is putting somewhat less into CalPERS and hoping to get bailed out by private sector taxpayers or the Federal Government someday. (CA isn't doing as badly as MA or IL or some others on pension funding, though) NYC is paying much more rationally and budgeting better than other big city and coastal governments which is one reason there are enough cops there to keep order.

GabrielF00 12y ago
>Including pension schemes and other benefits, it's common for mid-career CA cops to make upwards of $500k. Could you provide a source for this? I checked the salary database for the city and county of San Francisco and, while there were 2099 people in the police department with total pay over $100,000, nobody had total pay of $500,000 - and the maximum was $345,000. http://www.sfgate.com/news/databases/?appSession=458479105660989&RecordID=&PageID=2&PrevPageID=3&cpipage=3&CPISortType=&CPIorderBy= http://www.sfgate.com/news/databases/?appSession=45847910566...
- ssully 12y ago
  Maybe from working side jobs? Most police departments offer a ton of various side jobs. Be it renting out officers to basically do security for various businesses, or working at understaffed or undesirable locations. These jobs usually pay really well, sometimes between 60-80 dollars an hour. I have no clue if this extra pay would be shown in city salary databases, but I wouldn't be surprised if not.
- WildUtah 12y ago
  Base salaries are often only $100k but then generous vacation compensation, incentives, 2x and 3x overtime, and such bring it close to $200k. Gold plated health and other benefits often bring current compensation for CA cops (CHP, BART, SF, &c) over $200k. Then generous pensions kick in. CA cops and firemen usually get full pensions after 20-25 years but the pension is paid not just on salary but a multiple of final year vacation and comp time. Pensions can be 2x-3.5x final 'base' salary and higher than any overtime adjusted salary. CalPERS is hoping for 5% above inflation returns but for a decade has made about 1%. At 1%, you essentially have to save or take on future liability for the whole pension during working life. No private employer provides these benefits after 20-25 years or on this basis at all because it would mean bankruptcy. Public finance allows it so the total compensation of a cop getting $200k in salary, adjustments, and benefits is often over $500k all in. Some of that will be the bankruptcy and bailout. Google "Vallejo firefighter bankruptcy" for details of CA's future public safety service.
orbifold 12y ago

puredemo 12y ago

public unions are a scam. Who exactly are you negotiating against? Oh yeah, the taxpayer.

sthomas1618 12y ago

I'm not sure about that. I don't know about SF, but in many other CA cities, they have plenty of positions open, but are having trouble finding qualified candidates. Being in law enforcement is not very appealing.