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Your knowledge about Emacs was outdated then. And what make you think that Emacs cannot use Clang and LLVM? Currently, there's already rtags that uses Clang for

by tuhdo 12y ago

Your knowledge about Emacs was outdated then. And what make you think that Emacs cannot use Clang and LLVM? Currently, there's already rtags that uses Clang for live analysis: https://github.com/Andersbakken/rtags https://github.com/Andersbakken/rtags. Here are some nice features that Emacs provide: - Powerful automatic indentation: https://raw.githubusercontent.com/Bruce-Connor/aggressive-indent-mode/master/aggressive-indent.gif https://raw.githubusercontent.com/Bruce-Connor/aggressive-in.... It does not only indent the current line, but the whole Semantic context around your cursor. - Live grep: http://tuhdo.github.io/static/live_grep.gif http://tuhdo.github.io/static/live_grep.gif - Access to a list of project with a few key strokes: http://tuhdo.github.io/static/helm-projectile/helm-projectile-switch-project.gif http://tuhdo.github.io/static/helm-projectile/helm-projectil... - Quickly access any file in your project, as large as Linux kernel, instantly, regardless of where you are in the project, and within a few keystrokes: http://tuhdo.github.io/static/helm-projectile/helm-projectile-find-files-1.gif http://tuhdo.github.io/static/helm-projectile/helm-projectil.... - Jump to any file depends on context, even if the file path is in a plain ASCII text file: http://tuhdo.github.io/static/helm-projectile/helm-projectile-find-files-dwim-1.gif http://tuhdo.github.io/static/helm-projectile/helm-projectil... - Copy files from anywhere to anywhere: http://tuhdo.github.io/static/helm-projectile/helm-projectile-find-file-copy.gif http://tuhdo.github.io/static/helm-projectile/helm-projectil.... - Delete files anywhere; files are always at your finger tip to do whatever with them: http://tuhdo.github.io/static/helm-projectile/helm-projectile-find-file-delete.gif http://tuhdo.github.io/static/helm-projectile/helm-projectil.... - Switch between other files with same names but different extensions: http://tuhdo.github.io/static/helm-projectile/helm-projectile-find-other-file.gif http://tuhdo.github.io/static/helm-projectile/helm-projectil.... Work not only for C/C++ but other languages, and is customizable. You don't have to configure anything, like adding include paths for the command to search. Everything is automatic. Just use it as it is. - Jump to tag definition, from Emacs's own parser or external parser like GNU Global: http://tuhdo.github.io/static/c-ide/helm-gtags-jump-dwim.gif http://tuhdo.github.io/static/c-ide/helm-gtags-jump-dwim.gif - Jump to any definition from a list of definitions in source tree, even for Linux kernel: http://tuhdo.github.io/static/c-ide/helm-gtags-select.gif http://tuhdo.github.io/static/c-ide/helm-gtags-select.gif - Jump up to parent: http://tuhdo.github.io/static/c-ide/senator-go-to-up-reference.gif http://tuhdo.github.io/static/c-ide/senator-go-to-up-referen.... - Do you like outline tree?: http://tuhdo.github.io/static/c-ide/sr-speedbar.gif http://tuhdo.github.io/static/c-ide/sr-speedbar.gif - Interactive outline tree: http://tuhdo.github.io/static/c-ide/helm-semantic-or-imenu-with-struct.gif http://tuhdo.github.io/static/c-ide/helm-semantic-or-imenu-w... - Easily move back and forth using the interactive outline tree: http://tuhdo.github.io/static/part3/helm-semantic-or-imenu-2.gif http://tuhdo.github.io/static/part3/helm-semantic-or-imenu-2... - References retrieved from its Emacs internal parser: http://tuhdo.github.io/static/c-ide/semantic-symref.gif http://tuhdo.github.io/static/c-ide/semantic-symref.gif. - Beautiful compile output: http://tuhdo.github.io/static/c-ide/compilation-compile.gif http://tuhdo.github.io/static/c-ide/compilation-compile.gif - Frontend support for GDB: http://tuhdo.github.io/static/c-ide/gdb-many-windows.gif http://tuhdo.github.io/static/c-ide/gdb-many-windows.gif - Code completion: http://tuhdo.github.io/static/c-ide/semantic-boost-demo.gif http://tuhdo.github.io/static/c-ide/semantic-boost-demo.gif. - Open man page for symbol at cursor: http://tuhdo.github.io/static/part3/helm-man-woman.gif http://tuhdo.github.io/static/part3/helm-man-woman.gif. - Emacs open 39MB C file: http://tuhdo.github.io/static/performance.gif http://tuhdo.github.io/static/performance.gif - Emac opens multi-gigabtye file: http://www.emacswiki.org/VLF http://www.emacswiki.org/VLF - Emacs is a bit torrent client: https://bitbucket.org/ukaszg/aria2-mode/ https://bitbucket.org/ukaszg/aria2-mode/ You can see more demos in: + Emacs Mini Manual: http://tuhdo.github.io/emacs-tutor.html http://tuhdo.github.io/emacs-tutor.html + C/C++ Development Environment for Emacs: http://tuhdo.github.io/c-ide.html http://tuhdo.github.io/c-ide.html + A Package in a league of its own: Helm: http://tuhdo.github.io/helm-intro.html http://tuhdo.github.io/helm-intro.html + Exploring large projects with Projectile and Helm Projectile: http://tuhdo.github.io/helm-projectile.html http://tuhdo.github.io/helm-projectile.html Note that in the demos you may see me type in the commands. You can think of it like the start menu in Windows, but actually those commands can be executed quickly with a shortcut. I type in the commands for demonstration purpose to Emacs users. Those demos are just tip of the iceberg.

pjmlp 12y ago
Now show all those demos, without relying in clang. We in the real world have to use compiler toolchains specified by our customers. Do you also have demos for: - Navigate in binary files - Semantic refactory - Background compilation - Debug unit tests - Cross reference to source control checks and software tracking issues - Parallel code debugging - Visualization of C++ data structures - Semantic code navigation - Database integration - UML diagrams with two way code editing - UI design - Integration with application servers - Graphical visualization of profiling data - ... Emacs is a fine software, but it is stuck in the past.
- tuhdo 12y ago
  None of those relies on clang. And why do you think that it's ok for an IDE to use Clang, and Emacs is not? You misunderstood what Emacs is really. It's an environment for creating programs to run in it. At its core, Emacs is just Emacs Lisp interpreter. The editor frontend is for users to interact with this core, by directly using Lisp code or just using editing commands. Comparing Emacs to IDE is just like comparing Python interpreter to IDE; but the former has more potential to be anything it wants. > Navigate in binary files Yes. You have Hexl mode for editing binary files, ages ago: https://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/manual/html_node/emacs/Editing-Binary-Files.html https://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/manual/html_node/emacs/Ed... You can even open files with gigabytes size to edit: http://www.emacswiki.org/VLF http://www.emacswiki.org/VLF > Semantic refactory Fine. This can be done if someone puts the effort into making it. But text replace in whole project is good enough. Even so, things like that won't work with project like Linux kernel. Parsers in IDEs like Eclipse or VS just can't handle such complex project, so those IDEs are also useless. > Background compilation Yes. Emacs can do perform asynchronous operation. M-x compile and type in compilation command, then either do something else or see it display beautiful output: http://tuhdo.github.io/static/c-ide/compilation-compile.gif http://tuhdo.github.io/static/c-ide/compilation-compile.gif. In Eclipse, even for debugging a simple binary file, you have to create a project. This is absurd. > Debug unit tests What's the problem? If you write unit tests in a language, use that language debugger. Emacs has an integrated interface for many debuggers, even for Bash and Make. > Cross reference to source control checks and software tracking issues Why is this essential? If you want, you can write one in Emacs. However, use a proper bug tracking software, like BugZilla and use your browser. > Parallel code debugging Yes, GDB provides that, so Emacs has that too. See this screenshot again: http://tuhdo.github.io/static/c-ide/gdb-many-windows.gif http://tuhdo.github.io/static/c-ide/gdb-many-windows.gif. Notice the bottom right. You have a tab "Threads" in there. Clicking on a thread in the list will switch other windows (i.e. registers, stack frames) to the context of that thread. > Visualization of C++ data structures Yes, you have Ebrowse: http://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/manual/html_mono/ebrowse.html http://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/manual/html_mono/ebrowse.h..., that lists an index of classes in tree format. For example, if class is a child of a class, it is display as a child of that class in tree format. You can click on each class, you view all the member functions and can switch between declarations and definitions. Or use Doxygen: http://www.stack.nl/~dimitri/doxygen/ http://www.stack.nl/~dimitri/doxygen/ > Database integration Non-essential. I don't work with database. But, you can use Emacs as a database client if you want: http://truongtx.me/2014/08/23/setup-emacs-as-an-sql-database-client/ http://truongtx.me/2014/08/23/setup-emacs-as-an-sql-database... and it's better than many crappy database clients out there. > UML diagrams with two way code editing Non-essential. Again, use Doxygen if you want. > UI design Can your IDE work on multi-hop remote machines? > Integration with application servers So, is running a terminal emulator inside Emacs and run commands to control the servers enough? > Graphical visualization of profiling data Non-essential. Use a separate profiler. And please don't say that those IDEs are better because it can run some programs inside the same window, while Emacs relies on external programs. It's like saying Eclipse sucks and is not a real IDE because it uses gcc to compile code, not providing its own compiler. "IDE" is just a bunch of programs wired together.

by tuhdo 12y ago

pjmlp 12y ago

Now show all those demos, without relying in clang. We in the real world have to use compiler toolchains specified by our customers. Do you also have demos for: - Navigate in binary files - Semantic refactory - Background compilation - Debug unit tests - Cross reference to source control checks and software tracking issues - Parallel code debugging - Visualization of C++ data structures - Semantic code navigation - Database integration - UML diagrams with two way code editing - UI design - Integration with application servers - Graphical visualization of profiling data - ... Emacs is a fine software, but it is stuck in the past.

tuhdo 12y ago
None of those relies on clang. And why do you think that it's ok for an IDE to use Clang, and Emacs is not? You misunderstood what Emacs is really. It's an environment for creating programs to run in it. At its core, Emacs is just Emacs Lisp interpreter. The editor frontend is for users to interact with this core, by directly using Lisp code or just using editing commands. Comparing Emacs to IDE is just like comparing Python interpreter to IDE; but the former has more potential to be anything it wants. > Navigate in binary files Yes. You have Hexl mode for editing binary files, ages ago: https://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/manual/html_node/emacs/Editing-Binary-Files.html https://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/manual/html_node/emacs/Ed... You can even open files with gigabytes size to edit: http://www.emacswiki.org/VLF http://www.emacswiki.org/VLF > Semantic refactory Fine. This can be done if someone puts the effort into making it. But text replace in whole project is good enough. Even so, things like that won't work with project like Linux kernel. Parsers in IDEs like Eclipse or VS just can't handle such complex project, so those IDEs are also useless. > Background compilation Yes. Emacs can do perform asynchronous operation. M-x compile and type in compilation command, then either do something else or see it display beautiful output: http://tuhdo.github.io/static/c-ide/compilation-compile.gif http://tuhdo.github.io/static/c-ide/compilation-compile.gif. In Eclipse, even for debugging a simple binary file, you have to create a project. This is absurd. > Debug unit tests What's the problem? If you write unit tests in a language, use that language debugger. Emacs has an integrated interface for many debuggers, even for Bash and Make. > Cross reference to source control checks and software tracking issues Why is this essential? If you want, you can write one in Emacs. However, use a proper bug tracking software, like BugZilla and use your browser. > Parallel code debugging Yes, GDB provides that, so Emacs has that too. See this screenshot again: http://tuhdo.github.io/static/c-ide/gdb-many-windows.gif http://tuhdo.github.io/static/c-ide/gdb-many-windows.gif. Notice the bottom right. You have a tab "Threads" in there. Clicking on a thread in the list will switch other windows (i.e. registers, stack frames) to the context of that thread. > Visualization of C++ data structures Yes, you have Ebrowse: http://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/manual/html_mono/ebrowse.html http://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/manual/html_mono/ebrowse.h..., that lists an index of classes in tree format. For example, if class is a child of a class, it is display as a child of that class in tree format. You can click on each class, you view all the member functions and can switch between declarations and definitions. Or use Doxygen: http://www.stack.nl/~dimitri/doxygen/ http://www.stack.nl/~dimitri/doxygen/ > Database integration Non-essential. I don't work with database. But, you can use Emacs as a database client if you want: http://truongtx.me/2014/08/23/setup-emacs-as-an-sql-database-client/ http://truongtx.me/2014/08/23/setup-emacs-as-an-sql-database... and it's better than many crappy database clients out there. > UML diagrams with two way code editing Non-essential. Again, use Doxygen if you want. > UI design Can your IDE work on multi-hop remote machines? > Integration with application servers So, is running a terminal emulator inside Emacs and run commands to control the servers enough? > Graphical visualization of profiling data Non-essential. Use a separate profiler. And please don't say that those IDEs are better because it can run some programs inside the same window, while Emacs relies on external programs. It's like saying Eclipse sucks and is not a real IDE because it uses gcc to compile code, not providing its own compiler. "IDE" is just a bunch of programs wired together.