3 ms·

I'm sure someone else has considered this before, but perhaps optical illusions are similar examples of data that causes pathological behaviour? Many of them c

by arjie 12y ago

I'm sure someone else has considered this before, but perhaps optical illusions are similar examples of data that causes pathological behaviour? Many of them constrain our viewpoint or the sequence of images viewed so we'd be unable to take the actions you mention to handle them.

waps 12y ago
Exactly. Reading the paper, I have to say I disagree. Human minds are stable, for a very simple reason : they randomize inputs, they implicitly haar-cascade inputs simply because the sensors are inaccurate (they add time-variant noise like any real-world sensor), and they're mounted on a moving platform that constantly shifts position. The observation here should be that brains don't filter out noise, they use it to their advantage, to improve their performance. So it's simple : both problems referred in the text don't exist for noisy data, and it's easy to improve ANN's classifications performance through things akin to adding random noise and haar-cascade like approaches (shifting the input image slightly, in x, y, rotation, white balance, ...), then taking the prediction that you saw most often. You can even make neural nets that do this implicitly (though it's even more expensive). Anecdotally, I do think my own mind has this "problem". There are a large number of things I recognize immediately, but there are also quite a few things I have to look at for a few seconds to even a minute or two (usually geometrical stuff, network plans, or the like) before it "clicks" in my mind and I know what it is. Sometimes that is because I have to wait for the noise level to go down (e.g. exit a tunnel or a building into full sunlight), but usually it's not. I think it's very possible that at such times my mind is simply waiting until the noise in the input kicks it over some decision boundary. Also, I find people often reclassify things after looking at them a little while longer.
theforgottenone 12y ago
Yes. But more importantly, we are continuously training our network. There is no terminating "training set" except the set of all considered classifications. Our discovery of ourselves being "wrong" about a thing is our network continually adjusting. We also have the notion of ignorance. These classifiers are often forced to come to a conclusion, instead of having "I don't know, let me look at it from another angle" kind of self-adjustment process. "Aha, it is a cat!" moments do not happen for ai. In us, it would create a whole new layer to wrap the classifier around some uncertainty logic. We would be motivated to examine the reasons behind our initial failure, and use the conclusions to train this new layer, further developing strategies to adapt to those inputs.
- deleted 12y ago
  [deleted]

by arjie 12y ago

waps 12y ago

Exactly. Reading the paper, I have to say I disagree. Human minds are stable, for a very simple reason : they randomize inputs, they implicitly haar-cascade inputs simply because the sensors are inaccurate (they add time-variant noise like any real-world sensor), and they're mounted on a moving platform that constantly shifts position. The observation here should be that brains don't filter out noise, they use it to their advantage, to improve their performance. So it's simple : both problems referred in the text don't exist for noisy data, and it's easy to improve ANN's classifications performance through things akin to adding random noise and haar-cascade like approaches (shifting the input image slightly, in x, y, rotation, white balance, ...), then taking the prediction that you saw most often. You can even make neural nets that do this implicitly (though it's even more expensive). Anecdotally, I do think my own mind has this "problem". There are a large number of things I recognize immediately, but there are also quite a few things I have to look at for a few seconds to even a minute or two (usually geometrical stuff, network plans, or the like) before it "clicks" in my mind and I know what it is. Sometimes that is because I have to wait for the noise level to go down (e.g. exit a tunnel or a building into full sunlight), but usually it's not. I think it's very possible that at such times my mind is simply waiting until the noise in the input kicks it over some decision boundary. Also, I find people often reclassify things after looking at them a little while longer.

theforgottenone 12y ago

Yes. But more importantly, we are continuously training our network. There is no terminating "training set" except the set of all considered classifications. Our discovery of ourselves being "wrong" about a thing is our network continually adjusting. We also have the notion of ignorance. These classifiers are often forced to come to a conclusion, instead of having "I don't know, let me look at it from another angle" kind of self-adjustment process. "Aha, it is a cat!" moments do not happen for ai. In us, it would create a whole new layer to wrap the classifier around some uncertainty logic. We would be motivated to examine the reasons behind our initial failure, and use the conclusions to train this new layer, further developing strategies to adapt to those inputs.

deleted 12y ago
[deleted]