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I don't think there is actually any evidence they use Chrome for much more than 1. disrupt IE/MS - i can say for certain they originally backed Firefox for thi

by taf2 12y ago

I don't think there is actually any evidence they use Chrome for much more than 1. disrupt IE/MS - i can say for certain they originally backed Firefox for this effort and only decided to split away to build chrome in the first place because they felt starting fresh they could build a better core and i believe they did. 2. enabling more people to build on the web, enables more of their ads to be shown. Firefox achieves this just as well as chrome. IE was dominating not too long ago and you could argue much of google's ad revenue growth can be attributed to more people having access to a higher quality web. That said... I don't see why you should believe google would need or desire to sell data from what it might collect from Chrome. More likely they see it as a means to ensuring web dominance by ensuring the web is never locked down by one mega corp. It's similar in away to what they have done in the mobile space. Android is more of a technology to disrupt Apple and ensure it can't be dominate, but really does google have any control over Android?

chimeracoder 12y ago
> More likely they see it as a means to ensuring web dominance by ensuring the web is never locked down by one mega corp. I wouldn't let Google off the hook so easily. More like, they want to ensure that if/when it is, they are that one mega corp: https://i.imgur.com/AIxYzl9.jpg https://i.imgur.com/AIxYzl9.jpg If you ask me, the only reason they haven't moved even faster in this direction is because they're afraid of triggering the same legal action that Microsoft did back in the 90s with IE, but that doesn't mean that they wouldn't love to have that form of dominance - it can only help them.
bzbarsky 12y ago
1) Google never backed Firefox with a billion-dollar-a-year advertising campaign like they have Chrome for several years now. 2) It's not an accident that Google's webservices work best (sometimes only) in Chrome. They're way past the "disrupt IE" goal. They're into the "tightly couple our web service and Chrome and try to force out other options" goal.
- wodenokoto 12y ago
  I'd like to see a source for the billion-dollar-a-year campaign, that sounds crazy. That's 3 times Mozilla's entire budget, if memory serves me right.
  - whatusername 12y ago
    What do you think it would cost to put an Ad on the google homepage?
  - hyperbovine 12y ago
    $1 billion is Apple's ad budget as of two years ago and a non-trivial fraction of Coke's overall annual ad budget. I call bs. (http://www.asymco.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/Screen-Shot-2013-11-04-at-11-4-4.55.03-PM.png http://www.asymco.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/Screen-Shot...)
  - asadotzler 12y ago
    365 days a year for several years Google has had a Chrome banner ad on www.google.com showing to Firefox users. That page is the most lucrative property on the web in terms of eyeballs, so take your most outrageous ad rate you can find and do the math. It's billions per year worth of advertising.
    - SquareWheel 12y ago
      It's also completely free for Google to advertise on their own website.
      - valarauca1 12y ago
        Yes but that doesn't mean the economic value is non-existent. Theoretically Google could sell that space. They trade this potential profit to promote their own product, at a loss, of how ever much that space could be sold for. This is like economics 202, opportunity cost.
MichaelGG 12y ago
Google has used it's position in Android and Chrome to undermine privacy. Both platforms encourage users to "knowingly" give up privacy. This is beyond simply preventing monopolies.
jacquesm 12y ago
There never was a good reason for Chrome to exist in the first place. Content companies should not produce browsers, it is too much of a temptation for them to optimize their content for their own browser and vv.
- IvyMike 12y ago
  > There never was a good reason for Chrome to exist in the first place. Chrome kicked off the browser performance wars, especially javascript. A fast and performant web was important to any strategy Google could have had, regardless of their status as a good or evil company.
  - sphink 12y ago
    I agree. IE kicked everyone else's butt first (in terms of market share), and the Web stagnated. Then Firefox kicked IE's butt, and the Web didn't stagnate quite as much, but let's be honest -- it stagnated. At the moment, Chrome is dominant but no browser is really trampling its competition, especially not in terms of overall quality. And the Web is improving faster than it ever has. (Well, not quite -- the "catch up" phases of the browser wars probably saw faster improvement while they were happening.)
  - bzbarsky 12y ago
    Please check your history. There was a JavaScript performance war in full swing, with both Firefox and Safari producing new JITs and working on improving them, before Chrome ever appeared.
    - IvyMike 12y ago
      My memory was that there was a cold war, but not hot-and-heavy competition until chrome, although this article seems to agree with you. But man, Chrome sure got good fast. http://www.cnet.com/news/browser-war-centers-on-once-obscure-javascript/ http://www.cnet.com/news/browser-war-centers-on-once-obscure...
      - 12y ago
indygreg2 12y ago
If you sign in to Chrome, your bookmarks and full browsing history are uploaded to Google's servers. Only your passwords are encrypted locally before being sent to Google. https://support.google.com/chrome/answer/1181035 https://support.google.com/chrome/answer/1181035 contains info on how the encryption works. chrome://terms/ links to https://www.google.com/intl/en/chrome/browser/privacy/ https://www.google.com/intl/en/chrome/browser/privacy/ which links to http://www.google.com/policies/privacy/ http://www.google.com/policies/privacy/ to define "how we use information we collect." From that page: "We use the information we collect from all of our services to provide, maintain, protect and improve them, to develop new ones, and to protect Google and our users. We also use this information to offer you tailored content – like giving you more relevant search results and ads." Your full browsing history is a treasure trove of information useful for making Google's core services (search and ads) more effective. They would be stupid not to use it to improve the quality of their services. I challenge your assertion that Chrome is an altruistic endeavor.
- ChrisAntaki 12y ago
  Don't forget about omnibox predictions. By default, all keystrokes in the address bar are being sent, even while you're logged out. References: "Get predictions in the address bar" https://support.google.com/chrome/answer/95656?hl=en https://support.google.com/chrome/answer/95656?hl=en "Logging policies for omnibox predictions" https://support.google.com/chrome/answer/180655?hl=en https://support.google.com/chrome/answer/180655?hl=en
  - 0942v8653 12y ago
    uhh… with any "omnibox" UI in any browser, every keystroke is sent to Google.
    - espadrine 12y ago
      Based on my current knowledge, I believe you are wrong. Firefox' Desktop Awesomebar (which actually predates Chrome's omnibox) does not send every keystroke to Google[0], and never has. Even Firefox' Mobile Awesomebar doesn't do that[1] unless you click that "Yes" button. On the other hand, Google's Chrome browser is clear about the fact that it does send everything in the omnibar[2]: > When you type URLs or queries in the Chrome address bar (omnibox) or App Launcher search box, the letters you type may be sent to your default search engine so that the search engine’s prediction feature can automatically recommend terms or URLs you may be looking for. If you still believe you are right, I would be interested in seeing your sources. [0]: https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb/awesome-bar-find-your-bookmarks-history-and-tabs https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb/awesome-bar-find-your-b... [1]: https://blog.mozilla.org/privacy/2013/01/08/search-suggestions-for-firefox-for-android-another-example-of-mozillas-approach-to-privacy-by-design/ https://blog.mozilla.org/privacy/2013/01/08/search-suggestio... [2]: https://www.google.com/chrome/browser/privacy/ https://www.google.com/chrome/browser/privacy/
cwyers 12y ago
Disrupting MS is a big goal of Google's, but that ambition runs far beyond displacing IE. Google, via Chrome (and ChromeOS) and their online services, wants to displace Windows, Office and Exchange. Firefox helped (and still helps) to fend of Microsoft's browser share, but development of Chrome is what Google is using to push browsers towards being able to replace Windows and Office for enterprise customers.

by taf2 12y ago

chimeracoder 12y ago

> More likely they see it as a means to ensuring web dominance by ensuring the web is never locked down by one mega corp. I wouldn't let Google off the hook so easily. More like, they want to ensure that if/when it is, they are that one mega corp: https://i.imgur.com/AIxYzl9.jpg https://i.imgur.com/AIxYzl9.jpg If you ask me, the only reason they haven't moved even faster in this direction is because they're afraid of triggering the same legal action that Microsoft did back in the 90s with IE, but that doesn't mean that they wouldn't love to have that form of dominance - it can only help them.

bzbarsky 12y ago

1) Google never backed Firefox with a billion-dollar-a-year advertising campaign like they have Chrome for several years now. 2) It's not an accident that Google's webservices work best (sometimes only) in Chrome. They're way past the "disrupt IE" goal. They're into the "tightly couple our web service and Chrome and try to force out other options" goal.

wodenokoto 12y ago
I'd like to see a source for the billion-dollar-a-year campaign, that sounds crazy. That's 3 times Mozilla's entire budget, if memory serves me right.
- whatusername 12y ago
  What do you think it would cost to put an Ad on the google homepage?
- hyperbovine 12y ago
  $1 billion is Apple's ad budget as of two years ago and a non-trivial fraction of Coke's overall annual ad budget. I call bs. (http://www.asymco.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/Screen-Shot-2013-11-04-at-11-4-4.55.03-PM.png http://www.asymco.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/Screen-Shot...)
- asadotzler 12y ago
  365 days a year for several years Google has had a Chrome banner ad on www.google.com showing to Firefox users. That page is the most lucrative property on the web in terms of eyeballs, so take your most outrageous ad rate you can find and do the math. It's billions per year worth of advertising.
  - SquareWheel 12y ago
    It's also completely free for Google to advertise on their own website.
    - valarauca1 12y ago
      Yes but that doesn't mean the economic value is non-existent. Theoretically Google could sell that space. They trade this potential profit to promote their own product, at a loss, of how ever much that space could be sold for. This is like economics 202, opportunity cost.

MichaelGG 12y ago

Google has used it's position in Android and Chrome to undermine privacy. Both platforms encourage users to "knowingly" give up privacy. This is beyond simply preventing monopolies.

jacquesm 12y ago

There never was a good reason for Chrome to exist in the first place. Content companies should not produce browsers, it is too much of a temptation for them to optimize their content for their own browser and vv.

IvyMike 12y ago
> There never was a good reason for Chrome to exist in the first place. Chrome kicked off the browser performance wars, especially javascript. A fast and performant web was important to any strategy Google could have had, regardless of their status as a good or evil company.
- sphink 12y ago
  I agree. IE kicked everyone else's butt first (in terms of market share), and the Web stagnated. Then Firefox kicked IE's butt, and the Web didn't stagnate quite as much, but let's be honest -- it stagnated. At the moment, Chrome is dominant but no browser is really trampling its competition, especially not in terms of overall quality. And the Web is improving faster than it ever has. (Well, not quite -- the "catch up" phases of the browser wars probably saw faster improvement while they were happening.)
- bzbarsky 12y ago
  Please check your history. There was a JavaScript performance war in full swing, with both Firefox and Safari producing new JITs and working on improving them, before Chrome ever appeared.
  - IvyMike 12y ago
    My memory was that there was a cold war, but not hot-and-heavy competition until chrome, although this article seems to agree with you. But man, Chrome sure got good fast. http://www.cnet.com/news/browser-war-centers-on-once-obscure-javascript/ http://www.cnet.com/news/browser-war-centers-on-once-obscure...
    - 12y ago

indygreg2 12y ago

If you sign in to Chrome, your bookmarks and full browsing history are uploaded to Google's servers. Only your passwords are encrypted locally before being sent to Google. https://support.google.com/chrome/answer/1181035 https://support.google.com/chrome/answer/1181035 contains info on how the encryption works. chrome://terms/ links to https://www.google.com/intl/en/chrome/browser/privacy/ https://www.google.com/intl/en/chrome/browser/privacy/ which links to http://www.google.com/policies/privacy/ http://www.google.com/policies/privacy/ to define "how we use information we collect." From that page: "We use the information we collect from all of our services to provide, maintain, protect and improve them, to develop new ones, and to protect Google and our users. We also use this information to offer you tailored content – like giving you more relevant search results and ads." Your full browsing history is a treasure trove of information useful for making Google's core services (search and ads) more effective. They would be stupid not to use it to improve the quality of their services. I challenge your assertion that Chrome is an altruistic endeavor.

ChrisAntaki 12y ago
Don't forget about omnibox predictions. By default, all keystrokes in the address bar are being sent, even while you're logged out. References: "Get predictions in the address bar" https://support.google.com/chrome/answer/95656?hl=en https://support.google.com/chrome/answer/95656?hl=en "Logging policies for omnibox predictions" https://support.google.com/chrome/answer/180655?hl=en https://support.google.com/chrome/answer/180655?hl=en
- 0942v8653 12y ago
  uhh… with any "omnibox" UI in any browser, every keystroke is sent to Google.
  - espadrine 12y ago
    Based on my current knowledge, I believe you are wrong. Firefox' Desktop Awesomebar (which actually predates Chrome's omnibox) does not send every keystroke to Google[0], and never has. Even Firefox' Mobile Awesomebar doesn't do that[1] unless you click that "Yes" button. On the other hand, Google's Chrome browser is clear about the fact that it does send everything in the omnibar[2]: > When you type URLs or queries in the Chrome address bar (omnibox) or App Launcher search box, the letters you type may be sent to your default search engine so that the search engine’s prediction feature can automatically recommend terms or URLs you may be looking for. If you still believe you are right, I would be interested in seeing your sources. [0]: https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb/awesome-bar-find-your-bookmarks-history-and-tabs https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb/awesome-bar-find-your-b... [1]: https://blog.mozilla.org/privacy/2013/01/08/search-suggestions-for-firefox-for-android-another-example-of-mozillas-approach-to-privacy-by-design/ https://blog.mozilla.org/privacy/2013/01/08/search-suggestio... [2]: https://www.google.com/chrome/browser/privacy/ https://www.google.com/chrome/browser/privacy/

cwyers 12y ago

Disrupting MS is a big goal of Google's, but that ambition runs far beyond displacing IE. Google, via Chrome (and ChromeOS) and their online services, wants to displace Windows, Office and Exchange. Firefox helped (and still helps) to fend of Microsoft's browser share, but development of Chrome is what Google is using to push browsers towards being able to replace Windows and Office for enterprise customers.