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So the problem with revolutions is that there is usually little thought given to the system of order that will replace the current system - people are unhappy w
by recondite 12y ago
So the problem with revolutions is that there is usually little thought given to the system of order that will replace the current system - people are unhappy with the current one and they want change now. Historically, the result is something that ends up being worse than the original because the sudden loss of order has unintended second and third order effects. Dan Carlin has some great insights into this, with lots of historical examples. I would argue it's generally a good thing the government moves so slowly on things - as frustrating as it can be - the Founders intentionally set it up that way. In this case, it's hugely important that the press has re-gained some of its function as an investigative agency, as opposed to the role it took in the post-9/11 world as too often a mouthpiece of the powers that be. Awarding the Pulitzer is not something to be taken so lightly.
In the end, the people at the NSA still have a job to do (because people crave security), and whether or not you agree with their methods, will do whatever they think is necessary (within the bounds of the law, as they interpret it) to protect the country. If we take away the tools that Snowden exposed, do you really believe they will stop coming up with new surveillance methods? They will still manage to find ways to do their job, which you probably would not agree with either, but we would feel more secure knowing they're out there doing it. It's part of the social contract that we have with the government.
Like Snowden, I used to be a part of this community, and I would echo his early comments on how almost all the people he worked with did care about making the world better and were generally good people. These people are our family, friends, and neighbors. We vilify these agencies, but what I think Snowden is really trying to expose is how the entire system is set up in such a way that creates these incentives for national leadership and agencies to do these things. That system changed dramatically after 9/11, but I believe (and I'm sure Snowden believes) the system can be brought back to a more balanced state, it just has to be done slowly.
So maybe I'm too optimistic, but I don't believe rapid change is the answer we're looking for.
- ripb 12y ago>So maybe I'm too optimistic, but I don't believe rapid change is the answer we're looking for. You're right. Rapid change without direction only causes destabilization, and destabilization, whether it's politically or economically, is not something the US or EU could withstand well currently, and would potentially drastically weaken our joint position in the short-medium term internationally.
- trunnell 12y ago>So the problem with revolutions... No one is calling for revolution. >In the end, the people at the NSA still have a job to do... It's part of the social contract that we have with the government. What they've done seems to be the opposite of our social contract with our government. I'm pretty sure that's the reason people are upset. As Snowden said in the interview, people would not be ok with, for example, the government making a list of everything in your home and in your papers just in case it could be useful for a later investigation. The unwarranted seizure aspect of "collect everything" appears to contradict the citizenry's expectations. I don't question the intelligence community's intentions. I'm sure it's full of good people, just like the rest of the country. But practices seem to have evolved to be plainly unconstitutional, and it's very concerning that thoughtful IC insiders like yourself don't appear to appreciate that the situation is untenable. Immediate change to these practices is exactly what's called for.
- coryfklein 12y ago> It's part of the social contract that we have with the government. Not everyone agrees with your interpretation of social contract theory. I, for one, do not agree willingly to any contract with any government, but that doesn't change their belief that they have a right to their authority over me.