5 ms·

And this, in a nutshell, is why my wife and I let our son "online homeschool" when he asked. He's a freshman in highschool and to quote him: "I'm happy to not h

by earino 12y ago

And this, in a nutshell, is why my wife and I let our son "online homeschool" when he asked. He's a freshman in highschool and to quote him: "I'm happy to not have to deal with the arbitrary 'lord of the flies' social structure in High School and just be a normal person."

jemfinch 12y ago
How does he know what a normal person is?
- colechristensen 12y ago
  Nobody does as it doesn't really exist. Not wanting to participate in the aptly compared Lord of the Flies culture of high school is perfectly understandable, though. Moving from high school to a large university sees most all of that culture evaporate, and that lack of a strong social structure favoring the individual can certainly seem a whole lot more normal considering in the real world a person is much more free to leave rigid social structures if they choose.
thirdsun 12y ago
To be honest, I'd say there's actually some value in socializing and the concept of engaging with friends and students on a daily basis - especially outside of class. Aren't you worried that your kid might be missing out on those social interactions? There's a lot more to school life than attending several 90 minute classes in a row and calling it a day.
- NhanH 12y ago
  Everytime someone mentions "homeschool", there are always people asking: but what if the kid is missing out on (insert things). How about another point of view: high school students are (potentially) missing out on the opportunity to not wasting their time, to not being unhappy during the 3 years, to truly reach the potential they can be. I did not study high school in the US, but had I have the chance to be homeschooled, skip high school and graduate university at 20 without a social life, I'd take it in a heartbeat.
  - thirdsun 12y ago
    Fair point of view - but you make it seem as if having a bad time in school is a given. I'm from Germany, maybe it's different in US highschools, but back in my time (29 years old now), school life didn't have much in common with your average highschool movie. Bullying was a rare thing, being "different" not that big of a deal and we generally got along rather well. I sure as hell wouldn't have wanted to miss those days.
    - deleted 12y ago
      [deleted]
  - existencebox 12y ago
    I had a rather "terrible" public school social experience (like I'm sure many of the people in our field did, unfortunately, if I may be assumptive) which also failed to teach me much of anything of value. Even with all that time spun out for very little, I mark it as less of a waste than kindergarten, elementary, and middle school. Highschool _forces_ you to some extent to play the social game, if only to survive it; in either case you start to understand the true nature of people far more personally. These are all very important insights, IMO, and have served me well post-factum, both in college and in industry. I think the other posts in these comments indicate the "highschool" in both of those scenarios quite well. (And to address why I think the prior schoolings are so vapid, all of the lockstep progression through "tasks", gameable metrics, and the sheer environment that felt more like a babysitter than a place of learning removed both any natural drive to learn 'interesting' material AND any opportunity for social growth.)
- vellum 12y ago
  There are plenty of activities they can do outside the house: volunteer work, local sports leagues, community theater, a part-time job, etc.
- deleted 12y ago
  [deleted]
- mikeash 12y ago
  There's tremendous negative value in being locked in a building with a thousand teenage dickheads.
- crpatino 12y ago
  Agreed. I could have (and sometimes did) passed every high school exam with decent grades (~B+) without studying, just by having actually learned the K9 material during the previous years. However, what I got out of the experience was 2 things: First, I got a better grasp of the breath of human knowledge. It was mostly shallow, mind you, but in my mind it was like a buffet. You sample a little bit here and there, and figure out what you like and what makes you good (or sick). Second, it is the social interaction thing. I think this is important, but not in the way you imply. What I learned most in high-school in this aspect was: * How to deal with assholes. * * What to do when you are forced to be around with assholes. * * There are many kinds of assholes, and you should not deal with them in the same way (i.e. You can escalate conflict and make the typical bully back off, but this might prove a horrible mistake if attempted on the truly violent psycos). * * Assholes can climb into positions of authority too (aka asshole teachers). You need to know how to fly under their radar. * Dealing with Authority. * * Authorities are not necessarily competent or event interested in fulfilling their nominal roles. You have to educate yourself. * * Authorities do not care about your problems. You have to figure out and solve them yourself. * * Authorities are very interesting in maintaining the status quo. You do not go around shaking the waters without reason. * * * Unless you figure out how to turn status quo disruption into leverage. Then you go for it and turn authorities into unwilling allies in your dealings with assholes.

by earino 12y ago

jemfinch 12y ago

How does he know what a normal person is?

colechristensen 12y ago
Nobody does as it doesn't really exist. Not wanting to participate in the aptly compared Lord of the Flies culture of high school is perfectly understandable, though. Moving from high school to a large university sees most all of that culture evaporate, and that lack of a strong social structure favoring the individual can certainly seem a whole lot more normal considering in the real world a person is much more free to leave rigid social structures if they choose.

thirdsun 12y ago

To be honest, I'd say there's actually some value in socializing and the concept of engaging with friends and students on a daily basis - especially outside of class. Aren't you worried that your kid might be missing out on those social interactions? There's a lot more to school life than attending several 90 minute classes in a row and calling it a day.

NhanH 12y ago
Everytime someone mentions "homeschool", there are always people asking: but what if the kid is missing out on (insert things). How about another point of view: high school students are (potentially) missing out on the opportunity to not wasting their time, to not being unhappy during the 3 years, to truly reach the potential they can be. I did not study high school in the US, but had I have the chance to be homeschooled, skip high school and graduate university at 20 without a social life, I'd take it in a heartbeat.
- thirdsun 12y ago
  Fair point of view - but you make it seem as if having a bad time in school is a given. I'm from Germany, maybe it's different in US highschools, but back in my time (29 years old now), school life didn't have much in common with your average highschool movie. Bullying was a rare thing, being "different" not that big of a deal and we generally got along rather well. I sure as hell wouldn't have wanted to miss those days.
  - deleted 12y ago
    [deleted]
- existencebox 12y ago
  I had a rather "terrible" public school social experience (like I'm sure many of the people in our field did, unfortunately, if I may be assumptive) which also failed to teach me much of anything of value. Even with all that time spun out for very little, I mark it as less of a waste than kindergarten, elementary, and middle school. Highschool _forces_ you to some extent to play the social game, if only to survive it; in either case you start to understand the true nature of people far more personally. These are all very important insights, IMO, and have served me well post-factum, both in college and in industry. I think the other posts in these comments indicate the "highschool" in both of those scenarios quite well. (And to address why I think the prior schoolings are so vapid, all of the lockstep progression through "tasks", gameable metrics, and the sheer environment that felt more like a babysitter than a place of learning removed both any natural drive to learn 'interesting' material AND any opportunity for social growth.)
vellum 12y ago
There are plenty of activities they can do outside the house: volunteer work, local sports leagues, community theater, a part-time job, etc.
deleted 12y ago
[deleted]
mikeash 12y ago
There's tremendous negative value in being locked in a building with a thousand teenage dickheads.
crpatino 12y ago
Agreed. I could have (and sometimes did) passed every high school exam with decent grades (~B+) without studying, just by having actually learned the K9 material during the previous years. However, what I got out of the experience was 2 things: First, I got a better grasp of the breath of human knowledge. It was mostly shallow, mind you, but in my mind it was like a buffet. You sample a little bit here and there, and figure out what you like and what makes you good (or sick). Second, it is the social interaction thing. I think this is important, but not in the way you imply. What I learned most in high-school in this aspect was: * How to deal with assholes. * * What to do when you are forced to be around with assholes. * * There are many kinds of assholes, and you should not deal with them in the same way (i.e. You can escalate conflict and make the typical bully back off, but this might prove a horrible mistake if attempted on the truly violent psycos). * * Assholes can climb into positions of authority too (aka asshole teachers). You need to know how to fly under their radar. * Dealing with Authority. * * Authorities are not necessarily competent or event interested in fulfilling their nominal roles. You have to educate yourself. * * Authorities do not care about your problems. You have to figure out and solve them yourself. * * Authorities are very interesting in maintaining the status quo. You do not go around shaking the waters without reason. * * * Unless you figure out how to turn status quo disruption into leverage. Then you go for it and turn authorities into unwilling allies in your dealings with assholes.