4 ms·

Gut bacteria (specifically e. coli) have recently been identified as the root cause of both anorexia and bulimia [0]. I submited that paper here with no luck wh

by pygy_ 12y ago

Gut bacteria (specifically e. coli) have recently been identified as the root cause of both anorexia and bulimia [0]. I submited that paper here with no luck when it came out two weeks ago. —— [0] Bacterial ClpB heat-shock protein, an antigen-mimetic of the anorexigenic peptide α-MSH, at the origin of eating disorders http://www.nature.com/tp/journal/v4/n10/full/tp201498a.html http://www.nature.com/tp/journal/v4/n10/full/tp201498a.html

DanBC 12y ago
This is fascinating, thank you. It's surprising to see a causal link between ED and gut flora. Anorexia is, when we adjust for factors, the most fatal mental illness. Has anyone tested people who have a reliable diagnosis of either anorexia or bulimia? That would seem ethically easy enough. Especially since current treatment sometimes involves detention against the patient's ill in hospital, and forced naso-gastric feeding.
- pygy_ 12y ago
  It looks like it is as "mental" as tetanus and botulism... A friend of mine spent one month in solitary confinement as a "treatment" for her anorexia, when she was 14. That was 15 years ago, in France... The study linked above found cross-reactive antibodies in anorexia, bulimia and binge eating disorders patients. The next step would be to attempt fecal transplant for these patients.
- pja 12y ago
  Did you read the paper? They studied women with and without diagnosed eating disorders as part of the research. From a cursory read, it looks pretty damning to me - I'm not qualified to do a deep dive in the research methodology, but the conclusions look sound.
  - refurb 12y ago
    The did the tests in mice. Where do you see the studies with humans?
    - pygy_ 12y ago
      From the abstract: Finally, we show that plasma levels of anti-ClpB IgG crossreactive with α-MSH are increased in patients with AN, bulimia and [binge eating disorder], and that the [eating disorders] Inventory-2 scores in [eating disorders] patients correlate with anti-ClpB IgG and IgM, which is similar to our previous findings for α-MSH auto-Abs. Search in text for "Anti-ClpB antibodies in ED patients" for the details.
  - DanBC 12y ago
    Yes, sorry. The stuff about humans was a bit obs urred but I should have read it more carefully. I'm still trying to work out how many humans were used. It's a frustratingly dense read on mobile. EDIT: 65 control; 27 anorexia; 14 binge eating disorder. It's interesting, but I want to see very many more samples taken from women at different hospitals and the community.
    - pygy_ 12y ago
      The paper is very dense, overall. It is detailed in the legend of the 4th figure: ... Ctr, n=65, AN, n=27 BN, n=32 and BED, n=14 Crt = controls, AN = anorexia, BN = bulimia, BED = binge eating disorder. http://www.nature.com/tp/journal/v4/n10/fig_tab/tp201498f4.html#figure-title http://www.nature.com/tp/journal/v4/n10/fig_tab/tp201498f4.h...
cauterized 12y ago
Causative? Or correlated? Couldn't the causation go the other direction? (Would just read the paper but it won't load on this phone.)
- pygy_ 12y ago
  Causative. The full text is available in HTML for free, what kind of phone are you using?

by pygy_ 12y ago

DanBC 12y ago

This is fascinating, thank you. It's surprising to see a causal link between ED and gut flora. Anorexia is, when we adjust for factors, the most fatal mental illness. Has anyone tested people who have a reliable diagnosis of either anorexia or bulimia? That would seem ethically easy enough. Especially since current treatment sometimes involves detention against the patient's ill in hospital, and forced naso-gastric feeding.

pygy_ 12y ago
It looks like it is as "mental" as tetanus and botulism... A friend of mine spent one month in solitary confinement as a "treatment" for her anorexia, when she was 14. That was 15 years ago, in France... The study linked above found cross-reactive antibodies in anorexia, bulimia and binge eating disorders patients. The next step would be to attempt fecal transplant for these patients.
pja 12y ago
Did you read the paper? They studied women with and without diagnosed eating disorders as part of the research. From a cursory read, it looks pretty damning to me - I'm not qualified to do a deep dive in the research methodology, but the conclusions look sound.
- refurb 12y ago
  The did the tests in mice. Where do you see the studies with humans?
  - pygy_ 12y ago
    From the abstract: Finally, we show that plasma levels of anti-ClpB IgG crossreactive with α-MSH are increased in patients with AN, bulimia and [binge eating disorder], and that the [eating disorders] Inventory-2 scores in [eating disorders] patients correlate with anti-ClpB IgG and IgM, which is similar to our previous findings for α-MSH auto-Abs. Search in text for "Anti-ClpB antibodies in ED patients" for the details.
- DanBC 12y ago
  Yes, sorry. The stuff about humans was a bit obs urred but I should have read it more carefully. I'm still trying to work out how many humans were used. It's a frustratingly dense read on mobile. EDIT: 65 control; 27 anorexia; 14 binge eating disorder. It's interesting, but I want to see very many more samples taken from women at different hospitals and the community.
  - pygy_ 12y ago
    The paper is very dense, overall. It is detailed in the legend of the 4th figure: ... Ctr, n=65, AN, n=27 BN, n=32 and BED, n=14 Crt = controls, AN = anorexia, BN = bulimia, BED = binge eating disorder. http://www.nature.com/tp/journal/v4/n10/fig_tab/tp201498f4.html#figure-title http://www.nature.com/tp/journal/v4/n10/fig_tab/tp201498f4.h...

cauterized 12y ago

Causative? Or correlated? Couldn't the causation go the other direction? (Would just read the paper but it won't load on this phone.)

pygy_ 12y ago
Causative. The full text is available in HTML for free, what kind of phone are you using?