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Giving researchers and enthusiasts access to the Vatican Library collection for free over the Internet isn't really part of their mandate. There's no paywall,

by huxley 12y ago

Giving researchers and enthusiasts access to the Vatican Library collection for free over the Internet isn't really part of their mandate. There's no paywall, no onerous registration requirements, but you focus on a request for completely voluntary donations towards providing more free access documents ... really?

JoeAltmaier 12y ago
Not part of their mandate? They are caretaker of one of the worlds greatest collections of religious texts, and its not in their mandate to promote interest and research into those documents? What do you think their mandate may be?
- iterationx 12y ago
  Before the Vatican II sect apostatized from the Catholic Faith their mandate was "Go ye into the whole world, and preach the gospel to every creature." Matt 16:15 I can't really believe how stupid your comment is.
  - JoeAltmaier 12y ago
    And the documents they hold, are not related to the gospel? Do not illuminate it at all? Are wholly unrelated to that goal? Then why on earth did they collect them. Ad Hominem is not supposed to be a good argument tactic. I'll just say that, and not cast aspersions on your state of intelligence because that would be wrong.
    - jacalata 12y ago
      "I'm not going to call you an idiot because it would be wrong to say what an idiot you are."
- philwelch 12y ago
  Running the Roman Catholic Church perhaps? Providing spiritual leadership to a billion Catholics worldwide?
  - JoeAltmaier 12y ago
    ...and these religious documents they've curated, why did they do that? Presumably because they illuminate spiritual matters. Their dissemination directly relates to that goal. Or, they stole them because they were worth coin, and they are greedy. Which conclusion would you prefer I make? Never mind, either way they should pay the freight on this task.
    - philwelch 12y ago
      No one's saying you have to give one red cent. If enough other people find value in contributing to the project that's up to them. So why you mad, bro? For an institution that's millennia old and used to be the most powerful institution in the Western world, I'd be surprised if they didn't have a massive trove of historical manuscripts just out of historical accident.
      - JoeAltmaier 12y ago
        Lets imagine Merke wanted to crowd-fund their next drug? Or your banker crowd-funding interest? Or the local Laundromat crowd-funding soap? I just find it very strange.
        danielweber 12y ago
        Because those operations will fund it by selling the end product. Either the Church funds it by voluntary donations (from parishioners), or they fund it by voluntary donations (from people who want the documents put out for free).
        philwelch 12y ago
        Well those are for-profit business enterprises. The Vatican is the head of the Catholic Church, and as everyone else is pointing out, it's already crowdfunded.
        deleted 12y ago
        [deleted]
- ConceptJunkie 12y ago
  It's definitely not their primary mandate, but as a curator of these important relics and historical documents, it's definitely a good idea and worth doing. The Vatican has, in fact, supported all kinds of research over the centuries, and still does.
  - apaprocki 12y ago
    It's important to note how restricted all of this wealth of knowledge is. They could allow anyone with curiosity or interest to research for their own reasons, but they don't. I was actually curious if this behavior would change under the new Pope. Qualified scholars from institutions of higher education pursuing scientific researches, with an adequate knowledge of archival research, could apply for an entry card. Scholars need an introductory letter by either a recognized institute of research or by a suitably qualified person in the field of historical research. Applicants need to specify their personal data (name, address etc.) as well as the purpose of their research. Undergraduate students are not admitted. I have mixed feelings because if they wanted to be open they would just become open. Given all their restrictions it really comes off as if they want to "control the message" regarding anything they have collected over the centuries.
    - s-phi-nl 12y ago
      This stems from the concern (valid, in my opinion) of preserving the collection. If you let just anyone enter the physical library to access it, your risk would be higher that someone would accidentally damage or take some of the collection. For what it's worth, my understanding is that the Library of Congress has similar restrictions for accessing at least some of their archives.
      - apaprocki 12y ago
        Keep in mind these are the restrictions for the entire archive. Here, on the other hand, are the policies just for the LoC Rare Book & Specialized Collection Reading Room: http://www.loc.gov/rr/rarebook/policies.html http://www.loc.gov/rr/rarebook/policies.html tl;dr I can walk in and look at some rare books. The National Archives is similar, as well as NYC's archives downtown. I've been in both and have easily handled old-but-not-so-old (1800s) volumes. Putting that kind of restriction on the entire archives throws the baby out with the bathwater.

by huxley 12y ago

JoeAltmaier 12y ago

Not part of their mandate? They are caretaker of one of the worlds greatest collections of religious texts, and its not in their mandate to promote interest and research into those documents? What do you think their mandate may be?

iterationx 12y ago
Before the Vatican II sect apostatized from the Catholic Faith their mandate was "Go ye into the whole world, and preach the gospel to every creature." Matt 16:15 I can't really believe how stupid your comment is.
- JoeAltmaier 12y ago
  And the documents they hold, are not related to the gospel? Do not illuminate it at all? Are wholly unrelated to that goal? Then why on earth did they collect them. Ad Hominem is not supposed to be a good argument tactic. I'll just say that, and not cast aspersions on your state of intelligence because that would be wrong.
  - jacalata 12y ago
    "I'm not going to call you an idiot because it would be wrong to say what an idiot you are."
philwelch 12y ago
Running the Roman Catholic Church perhaps? Providing spiritual leadership to a billion Catholics worldwide?
- JoeAltmaier 12y ago
  ...and these religious documents they've curated, why did they do that? Presumably because they illuminate spiritual matters. Their dissemination directly relates to that goal. Or, they stole them because they were worth coin, and they are greedy. Which conclusion would you prefer I make? Never mind, either way they should pay the freight on this task.
  - philwelch 12y ago
    No one's saying you have to give one red cent. If enough other people find value in contributing to the project that's up to them. So why you mad, bro? For an institution that's millennia old and used to be the most powerful institution in the Western world, I'd be surprised if they didn't have a massive trove of historical manuscripts just out of historical accident.
    - JoeAltmaier 12y ago
      Lets imagine Merke wanted to crowd-fund their next drug? Or your banker crowd-funding interest? Or the local Laundromat crowd-funding soap? I just find it very strange.
      - danielweber 12y ago
        Because those operations will fund it by selling the end product. Either the Church funds it by voluntary donations (from parishioners), or they fund it by voluntary donations (from people who want the documents put out for free).
      - philwelch 12y ago
        Well those are for-profit business enterprises. The Vatican is the head of the Catholic Church, and as everyone else is pointing out, it's already crowdfunded.
      - deleted 12y ago
        [deleted]
ConceptJunkie 12y ago
It's definitely not their primary mandate, but as a curator of these important relics and historical documents, it's definitely a good idea and worth doing. The Vatican has, in fact, supported all kinds of research over the centuries, and still does.
- apaprocki 12y ago
  It's important to note how restricted all of this wealth of knowledge is. They could allow anyone with curiosity or interest to research for their own reasons, but they don't. I was actually curious if this behavior would change under the new Pope. Qualified scholars from institutions of higher education pursuing scientific researches, with an adequate knowledge of archival research, could apply for an entry card. Scholars need an introductory letter by either a recognized institute of research or by a suitably qualified person in the field of historical research. Applicants need to specify their personal data (name, address etc.) as well as the purpose of their research. Undergraduate students are not admitted. I have mixed feelings because if they wanted to be open they would just become open. Given all their restrictions it really comes off as if they want to "control the message" regarding anything they have collected over the centuries.
  - s-phi-nl 12y ago
    This stems from the concern (valid, in my opinion) of preserving the collection. If you let just anyone enter the physical library to access it, your risk would be higher that someone would accidentally damage or take some of the collection. For what it's worth, my understanding is that the Library of Congress has similar restrictions for accessing at least some of their archives.
    - apaprocki 12y ago
      Keep in mind these are the restrictions for the entire archive. Here, on the other hand, are the policies just for the LoC Rare Book & Specialized Collection Reading Room: http://www.loc.gov/rr/rarebook/policies.html http://www.loc.gov/rr/rarebook/policies.html tl;dr I can walk in and look at some rare books. The National Archives is similar, as well as NYC's archives downtown. I've been in both and have easily handled old-but-not-so-old (1800s) volumes. Putting that kind of restriction on the entire archives throws the baby out with the bathwater.