5 ms·

Well a driver less car is certainly more expensive than the uber provided driver if your ignore the costs of the drivers car, the costs of getting them to the a

Well a driver less car is certainly more expensive than the uber provided driver if your ignore the costs of the drivers car, the costs of getting them to the age the can drive, teaching them to drive, and on and on and on. The issue I see is that driver less cars have to be better than the better than average driver. Equal to an average driver is not sufficient. Even an average driver can tell the difference between a cardboard box and a block of concrete in the road, can follow detour signs, and more. Driver less cars and public transportation may end up either competing or playing off each other. Who knows. Though I would expect driver less buses and semi trucks far sooner than individual cars - there is at least a market fo those. Heck I see still drives on trains, I guess until we can end that position how do we expect cars to go it alone? (and train drivers are responsible for some major accidents both with people and cargo)

JoeAltmaier 12y ago
Not fair! You don't get to count the entire cost of raising a child, in the cost of a human driver. Just the marginal cost of convincing an adult to take on the job of 'driver'. Driverless cars are better because they are available. Recently here (on HN) was a post about why you can't find a taxi in the rain. (The answer was demand.) But another part is, many cabs are parked in the garage most of the time. Because drivers work only a few hours a day, and are not on-call during peak demand hours like rainstorms. Automated cabs could be scheduled and deployed minute by minute. That's a clear win.
- wavefunction 12y ago
  Owner/operators often rent out their taxis to other drivers. The real win will be getting all the idle passenger cars out of parking garages/lots and freeing up all that space imo.
  - toomuchtodo 12y ago
    > The real win will be getting all the idle passenger cars out of parking garages/lots and freeing up all that space imo. That space is of trivial importance compared to limited road space. Roads need to be used as efficiently as possible, as there's only so much asphalt/concrete between two points.
    - JoeAltmaier 12y ago
      Its all part of the problem. Isn't LA something like 40% devoted to cars? Counting roads, parking, service stations, sales lots.
- dragonwriter 12y ago
  > Just the marginal cost of convincing an adult to take on the job of 'driver'. You also should count the opportunity cost of the contribution that the adult could make if they weren't spending the time being a driver.
lucaspiller 12y ago
> Heck I see still drives on trains, I guess until we can end that position how do we expect cars to go it alone? (and train drivers are responsible for some major accidents both with people and cargo) I've always wondered why there hasn't been more progress on this front. Driverless trains have been around for 50 years now [0]. Anyone care to comment further? [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automatic_train_operation https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automatic_train_operation
- negativeview 12y ago
  At least here in Minneapolis, a good portion of the train operates down the middle of public streets. It follows red lights and has to deal with people pulling into intersections waiting on a turn signal, stupid pedestrians, etc. Even WITH drivers two people (that I know of) have been hit in the last two months. The train line wasn't set up with driverless uses in mind in the first place, and the city is likely worried about liability and cost in switching over. Even if the number of accidents goes down with full automation, cities aren't likely to believe that until enough other places prove it for them.
  - aragot 12y ago
    Sure, but wouldn't automation provide something more? If people know it's automatic, they're less enclined to assume the driver will stop; There is also less risk that the computer-driver is at fault; and last but not least, the video of the accident could be tweeted immediately so everyone is convinced that the biker/pedestrian/car is at fault. As opposed to human drivers, who are more reluctant to be filmed because it invades their privacy.
    - negativeview 12y ago
      All of those things are logical and make sense, but are unproven. Politicians are notoriously risk adverse when it comes to those kinds of risks.
  - lucaspiller 12y ago
    My comment was more aimed separate railways - what you have sounds more like a tram. Here they are building a new tramline, and there has already been a collision with a car before it even opened :D

JoeAltmaier 12y ago

Not fair! You don't get to count the entire cost of raising a child, in the cost of a human driver. Just the marginal cost of convincing an adult to take on the job of 'driver'. Driverless cars are better because they are available. Recently here (on HN) was a post about why you can't find a taxi in the rain. (The answer was demand.) But another part is, many cabs are parked in the garage most of the time. Because drivers work only a few hours a day, and are not on-call during peak demand hours like rainstorms. Automated cabs could be scheduled and deployed minute by minute. That's a clear win.

wavefunction 12y ago
Owner/operators often rent out their taxis to other drivers. The real win will be getting all the idle passenger cars out of parking garages/lots and freeing up all that space imo.
- toomuchtodo 12y ago
  > The real win will be getting all the idle passenger cars out of parking garages/lots and freeing up all that space imo. That space is of trivial importance compared to limited road space. Roads need to be used as efficiently as possible, as there's only so much asphalt/concrete between two points.
  - JoeAltmaier 12y ago
    Its all part of the problem. Isn't LA something like 40% devoted to cars? Counting roads, parking, service stations, sales lots.
dragonwriter 12y ago
> Just the marginal cost of convincing an adult to take on the job of 'driver'. You also should count the opportunity cost of the contribution that the adult could make if they weren't spending the time being a driver.

lucaspiller 12y ago

> Heck I see still drives on trains, I guess until we can end that position how do we expect cars to go it alone? (and train drivers are responsible for some major accidents both with people and cargo) I've always wondered why there hasn't been more progress on this front. Driverless trains have been around for 50 years now [0]. Anyone care to comment further? [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automatic_train_operation https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automatic_train_operation

negativeview 12y ago
At least here in Minneapolis, a good portion of the train operates down the middle of public streets. It follows red lights and has to deal with people pulling into intersections waiting on a turn signal, stupid pedestrians, etc. Even WITH drivers two people (that I know of) have been hit in the last two months. The train line wasn't set up with driverless uses in mind in the first place, and the city is likely worried about liability and cost in switching over. Even if the number of accidents goes down with full automation, cities aren't likely to believe that until enough other places prove it for them.
- aragot 12y ago
  Sure, but wouldn't automation provide something more? If people know it's automatic, they're less enclined to assume the driver will stop; There is also less risk that the computer-driver is at fault; and last but not least, the video of the accident could be tweeted immediately so everyone is convinced that the biker/pedestrian/car is at fault. As opposed to human drivers, who are more reluctant to be filmed because it invades their privacy.
  - negativeview 12y ago
    All of those things are logical and make sense, but are unproven. Politicians are notoriously risk adverse when it comes to those kinds of risks.
- lucaspiller 12y ago
  My comment was more aimed separate railways - what you have sounds more like a tram. Here they are building a new tramline, and there has already been a collision with a car before it even opened :D