7 ms·
Some background. - the proposed rate is 150 HUF/GB, that's around 0.5 EUR/GB or 60 cents/GB. - the internet speeds in Hungary are relatively high, it's quite
by sz4kerto 12y ago
Some background.
- the proposed rate is 150 HUF/GB, that's around 0.5 EUR/GB or 60 cents/GB.
- the internet speeds in Hungary are relatively high, it's quite common to get 100 Mbps for $20/mo
- the minimum wage is around 250 USD/mo, the average net wage is $650/mo
- the levy should be paid by the providers, but probably they're going to be able to deduct it from their other taxes, that means profitable companies won't pay, currently non-profitable companies will
- the tax will be capped per subscription, the cap is rumored to be around $4 for individuals and around $25 for companies -- but most households have 2-3-4 phones, cable internet, etc.
- it's very likely that this is going to wipe out the currently loss-making telcos that can then be bought by the state (nationalized) and their assets funneled to cronies (even there was a public bid for the assets nobody would start a new company as it'd be making losses in the beginning therefore they could not deduct this tax from their taxes -- so it'd result in even more losses)
Also, it's very much likely that this is a deliberate distraction from the political conflict between the USA and Hungary that has emerged last week. (Edit: it's still bad though, as a journalist put it, it's like spraying pepper in the eyes of a pitbull: it's distracting, but you might end up in a really big trouble.)
- pentium10 12y agointernet speeds in Hungary are not so high. Look at east Romania what offers, you get 1GBps for 7 euro/mo.
- sz4kerto 12y agoRomania is really an outlier -- but compared to the USA or the UK, Hungary still fares very well (a cheap 100 Mbps internet basically 'should be enough for anyone' -- not completely true, but that can serve multiple 4K video streams at the same time, so for most households it's perfect).
- Ecio78 12y agoI am paying 50euro/month for 30Mbit/10Mbit Fiber in Luxembourg :/ In Italy I was paying about 25-30Euro/month for 20Mbit/1Mbit ADSL (and actually 20 was never 20 but more around 12-15..
- deleted 12y ago[deleted]
- wil421 12y agoDo people actually have multiple 4k montiors and multiple streaming services to serve content to those devices? I pay about $40 for 50Mb/15Mb and there is barely anything I can do to max this out.
- scrollaway 12y agoPlease remember that not everyone lives in a household of one. A household hosting say, six independent people can easily cap a 100Mbps connection.
- wil421 12y agoI live with 3 people and unless someone is downloading a torrent there is no way netflix/hulu/youtube playing at once is going to cap 50Mb or 100Mb.
- scrollaway 12y agoHow about a group of 4 friends who buy a game on steam together and want to download it and try it out together? That can easily be 30 gigabytes that has to be downloaded by 4 people, capping the connection over a sustained amount of time.
- qq66 12y agoSure, but does any public policy need to be directed towards this use case, or the six simultaneous Netflix streams? I would think that increasing Internet adoption by 1% would have more tangible gains than increasing speed by tenfold, once you are at figures like 5 or 10 Mbps.
- ericd 12y agoYes, because there are many use cases which will crop up once internet speeds aren't so constrained in so many places. If you could download very large files very quickly in almost every location, I'm fairly sure that computing would change rather dramatically.
- cbg0 12y ago12.45 EUR actually with VAT, assuming you just buy the Internet connection, and not as part of a package.
- NicoJuicy 12y ago"Fun" fact: the reason why internet is cheap / fast is because of the webcam industry in Romania.
- MrJagil 12y agosource?
- paganel 12y agoI'm not so sure about that. Source: I'm Romanian. The best and most accurate explanation that I could find after a quick search was this one: http://np.reddit.com/r/europe/comments/2ct58s/average_internet_speed_in_eu_by_country/cjiyt5n?context=3 http://np.reddit.com/r/europe/comments/2ct58s/average_intern... """ tl;dr Romanians love movies, we needed a way to download them and fiber was the answer. Much cheaper than copper, no risk of the cables getting stolen. """
- shock 12y agoSpotted: Python programmer ^^^
- hippiehippo 12y agoTL;DR: BitTorrent being the reason doesn't sound so interesting for a Vice article. As a person who helped build a "district ISP network" back in the early 2000s, I can tell you that that reason is just some Vice.com style linkbait. Romania has great Internet speeds because the authorities tolerated us installing cables all over the darn place. Back then it wasn't uncommon to have almost half a dozen ISPs in a one square mile neighbourhood, all offering 50-100 mbps in the city and 1-2 mbps actual Internet speeds, without any FUP. We were almost the same age and people didn't care about the low international speeds because we could all share movies and music at 50+ mbps (and 0.5 mbps was more than enough for browsing). This was happening way before the video chat industry took off. Also, for that kind of stuff you need good sustained upload, but the ISPs are still limiting the upload speed to around 30 mbps even for gigabit connections. This doesn't affect BitTorrent (which can be left open over night).
- butterbeer 12y agoAre there data caps? Also, how is the upload speed?
- sbalea 12y agoNo data caps, 100mbps in network, 30mbps upload speed to the internet at large.
- deleted 12y ago[deleted]
- deleted 12y ago[deleted]
- netcan 12y agoThe problem is not necessarily directly the tax, but the barriers and bureaucracy around it making the whole industry less dynamic. $4 per household is not in itself terrible. The cronyism is also a concern. The reason policies like this are viable politically is because public policy economists are far more comfortable estimating the direct effects of a tax than they are estimating some of the murkier, but nonetheless inevitable implications. 1st year microeconomics students learn to draw the supply and demand curves, draw in the price after tax and calculate lost consumer surplus and profits. It's core economics material.
- topppk 12y agowhat you're referring to as 250USD/mo is basically unemployment benefits. i've got no idea where you got $650/mo from though. -the minimum wage in hungary is actually 328 EUR (~430 USD) / month in 2014 https://www.google.hu/search?q=minimum+wage+in+hungary https://www.google.hu/search?q=minimum+wage+in+hungary -the average wage in hungary for full-time employed people was actually ~975USD / month in the first half of 2014. http://www.vg.hu/gazdasag/makrogazdasag/ennyi-az-atlagber-magyarorszagon-kik-keresnek-a-legjobban-433755 http://www.vg.hu/gazdasag/makrogazdasag/ennyi-az-atlagber-ma...
- sz4kerto 12y ago$650/mo is the avg. wage _after tax_ (around 150kHUF) -- I should have mentioned that. You're absolutely right that I got the minimum wage wrong (I meant net minimum wage though).
- SilasX 12y agoYou did mention it: "the average net wage is $650/mo"; I assumed "net wage" meant "wage after taxes". There's no star to indicate that this phrasing is the result of a later edit.
- sz4kerto 12y agoOops, you're right. I assumed that the grandparent is right and I made a mistake without looking at my original post. Well, lack of self-confidence :) (I didn't edit that part of the original post.)
- ionelm 12y ago> Also, it's very much likely that this is a deliberate distraction from the political conflict between the USA and Hungary that has emerged last week. Strange theory. Have you considered they just need the extra money? Also, it wouldn't be a huge distraction anyway (from whatever) - I'm pretty sure they could invent more revolting taxes if they wanted to.