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I work in startups in NYC. None of the things described are even remotely close to shocking for me - I've seen all of the above first-hand either in offices or

I work in startups in NYC. None of the things described are even remotely close to shocking for me - I've seen all of the above first-hand either in offices or at startup events. That said, I've never seen all those things under the same roof, much less in a single day. The perfect storm of insanity makes me doubt the author's story a little bit, but each of the things she's brought up I've seen. Shit, I literally just read a racist internal email an hour ago about the new cleaning lady at the office. Plus the pointless credential-rundown you get every. single. goddamn. time. you meet a startup person in this city. Oh, you went to Harvard 10 years ago? That's so relevant considering we just met 2 minutes ago! You used to work at Goldman and now you're doing a consumer-tech startup? Yeah, that really needed to be in the first 3 sentences you've ever spoken to me.

ritchiea 12y ago
Oh my god it is exactly like that. As though pushing spreadsheets at Goldman has anything to do with building a software product. But they know that, they just want you to know they worked at Goldman. Because Goldman. I once worked under a CTO who remarked "it's not like we're going to hire a woman" after interviewing a female dev candidate, which would be horribly offensive even if he was just kidding (he wasn't kidding, I was shocked he even took the time to interview her). There's definitely a sense of "startups are the new banking." It's frustrating because there are also a lot of good people, but man is there a glut of bros who fit all the worst stereotypes of old boys club business.
- dccoolgai 12y ago
  |There's definitely a sense of "startups are the new banking." We need a new word. "Startup" has essentially become as meaningless as "agile". Semantically, "startup" is now just an umbrella under which the same paper-pushers and conference-call-bros we were trying to escape from are convening.
  - gearoidoc 12y ago
    I used to agree but I recently read this old quote from PG which nails it I think: "A startup is a company designed to grow fast. Being newly founded does not in itself make a company a startup." http://www.paulgraham.com/growth.html http://www.paulgraham.com/growth.html
    - frostmatthew 12y ago
      I have nothing but respect and admiration for PG, but I don't think he gets to unilaterally decide the meaning of words. Wikipedia says a startup is "a partnership or temporary organization designed to search for a repeatable and scalable business model"[1]. The relevant Wiktionary entry defines it as a "new organization or business venture"[2], fairly similar to the OED's "newly established business" definition[3]. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Startup_company https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Startup_company [2] http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/startup http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/startup [3] http://www.oxforddictionaries.com/us/definition/american_english/start-up http://www.oxforddictionaries.com/us/definition/american_eng...
      - kyleashipley 12y ago
        As a counterpoint, the Wikipedia definition of startup was coined by Steve Blank sometime in the past ~5 years, so it's not exactly ancient history. I think if we place emphasis on the word "scalable," PG + Blank's definitions are compatible. Both distinguish "startup" from "new company." I don't think most people would categorize building a tech company and starting a hair salon as the same activity because of the force multiplier of scale.
- rquantz 12y ago
  I can do one better. I went to a job fair type event with one of the cofounders of the company, and I was pushing a very qualified woman we met there. The cofounder told me, with a very thoughtful look on his face, "I'm not sexist... but I just don't like working with women."
x0x0 12y ago
I work at startups at the valley. I was briefly employed at one that was sending candidates a code test that involved printing a picture of a naked woman (in ascii art, but naked nonetheless). In mid-2014. From a cto who was a senior manager at google and presumably took at least one sexual harassment class.
- RyJones 12y ago
  The HR guy in the sexual harassment videos you had to watch every two years at Microsoft was fired for sexual harassment. No amount of training seems to overcome base desire.
  - pjlegato 12y ago
    It's not about base desires, it's that some people are simply assholes. No amount of training will overcome someone's asshole nature. There is a prevalent and totally erroneous school of thought which naively assumes that people do bad things simply because they don't know any better, and so all you have to do is take them aside as you would a misbehaving kindergartener for some "training" and then all will be well. It doesn't work that way. Some people are just assholes and always will be, irrespective of any amount of "training" you give them.
    - RyJones 12y ago
      You're right. I made a facile comment in haste and I was wrong.
    - thecage411 12y ago
      I don't think that school of thought is actually prevelant. They make you go to training classes so if there is a lawsuit they can point to all the training and say it's the individual's fault, not the company's.
    - aptwebapps 12y ago
      Some people, sure. But I don't think everyone who misbehaves is irredeemable.
MCRed 12y ago
For me, it's a huge signal when a founder or exec at a startup mentions an ivy league school or a "marquee" name. I've worked for big names in tech, I don't go around bragging about it. Only time to brag is if you were a cofounder of the company you're referring to. Who hasn't worked for a Google/Amazon/Microsoft/Apple/Facebook/etc? You worked at goldman? Ok, so I'm to take from that the assumption that you're entitled and incompetent to be leading a tech startup? Good to know. You went to Harvard? And you think this is relevant? So you care about pedigree more than competence? We can expect nepotism as you hire your friends? Good to know. These are great services they are offering-- you know not to take the job.
- inthewoods 12y ago
  Sign of the end for the startup economy imho - I remember during the first dot com bubble that when the consultants/MBAs starting doing startups (broadly) it was time to pack it up. Not that all MBAs or consultants are bad - but it isn't a good sign. Like a great party that has been discovered by the assh*les. I hope I'm wrong, but man, it feels familiar.
- GFischer 12y ago
  Well, in Uruguay, if you get to Facebook or Google or Apple, you literally make the news: http://www.elpais.com.uy/vida-actual/felipe-primer-uruguayo-que-trabajara-facebook.html http://www.elpais.com.uy/vida-actual/felipe-primer-uruguayo-... That's the biggest newspaper in the country, which incorrectly identified the first Uruguayan who worked for Facebook. Interestingly, there are quite a few Uruguayans at Microsoft, and I think there are a couple at Google.
bane 12y ago
I was on a team trying to setup a spinout company in Australia of all places. My corporate overlords built a team, boy band style, to go investigate the market with a minimum product, really experienced people who had seen and done a lot. About half the team was on their second career after retiring out of their first, but all were brilliant. I think we added it up and there was something like 170 years of experience in my small group (I was by far the junior person on the team). During the sit down on the marketing meeting a new person was introduced to the team (not unusual). They came up to the group and was obviously another senior, experienced addition to the group, hopefully with a long and interesting career behind them. They walked up to the front of the group and introduced themselves, "Hi I'm <name>, I went to Yale" and sat down at the table and proceeded to offer nothing of any substance over the next 8 weeks until they were quietly asked to go "contribute" their Yale credentials somewhere else. I've been hit with every kind of credential wagging since then, "When I was at McKinsey..."* or "When I went to Harvard..."+ are usually immediate signs of an immensely useless person and I go out of my way to avoid them. It's actually kind of pathetic. The best people I've ever met actually seemed a bit shy about notable credentials in their past and it wasn't until after months of probing that I could finally learn about some cool job or notable place they went to school. * I wrote this before reading the article + seriously, it's like a cliche
- notch90 12y ago
  They should fire the co-founder. That is unacceptable behavior.
- mhoad 12y ago
  As an interesting side anecdote, I just spent the last 6 months living in Kenya with the same kind of Harvard / McKinsey style crowd except in the social enterprise / NGO space. As someone who was coming from a very different background to a lot of these people, I wasn't exactly sure what to expect. While I would be the first to admit that things are less than perfect in a number of ways, generally speaking the people I met and eventually ended up consulting for couldn't possibly be much further from some of the personalities described in a number of the comments here. Overall I was super impressed with the humility, the intelligence and the general standard that I saw in a lot of these people. Then again, there is a world of difference between someone who chooses to live on next to nothing in a 3rd world country where they are there primarily to help others and the types described in the article.
S4M 12y ago
>Oh, you went to Harvard 10 years ago? That's so relevant considering we just met 2 minutes ago! You used to work at Goldman and now you're doing a consumer-tech startup? Yeah, that really needed to be in the first 3 sentences you've ever spoken to me. I agree that it's a bit pointless to mention that you studied in a prestigious university, but unlike the other commenters I think it makes sense to say that you worked in a company that is reputed to pay well, because if you left that well paying job it means that you have high hopes for that startup. Of course it would be douchey to say "Hey, I am Sam, and I used to work at Goldman, so kneel in front of me!", but saying "I worked at Goldman but I believe there is more money to be made in the house cleaning space" is a sign of confidence in the company - something I would like to see in a founder.
- personZ 12y ago
  because if you left that well paying job If someone says that they worked at a well paying job, my suspicion would be that they were run out of it, doubly so if they were engaged with such a shoddy, rag tag start-up. It would take pretty strong evidence to the contrary to believe otherwise.
atomical 12y ago
Your last paragraph has me cracking up. It reminds me of Todd Barry's sarcastic delivery.
EliRivers 12y ago
"Shit, I literally just read a racist internal email an hour ago about the new cleaning lady at the office." Serious question. What did you do about it?

ritchiea 12y ago

Oh my god it is exactly like that. As though pushing spreadsheets at Goldman has anything to do with building a software product. But they know that, they just want you to know they worked at Goldman. Because Goldman. I once worked under a CTO who remarked "it's not like we're going to hire a woman" after interviewing a female dev candidate, which would be horribly offensive even if he was just kidding (he wasn't kidding, I was shocked he even took the time to interview her). There's definitely a sense of "startups are the new banking." It's frustrating because there are also a lot of good people, but man is there a glut of bros who fit all the worst stereotypes of old boys club business.

dccoolgai 12y ago
|There's definitely a sense of "startups are the new banking." We need a new word. "Startup" has essentially become as meaningless as "agile". Semantically, "startup" is now just an umbrella under which the same paper-pushers and conference-call-bros we were trying to escape from are convening.
- gearoidoc 12y ago
  I used to agree but I recently read this old quote from PG which nails it I think: "A startup is a company designed to grow fast. Being newly founded does not in itself make a company a startup." http://www.paulgraham.com/growth.html http://www.paulgraham.com/growth.html
  - frostmatthew 12y ago
    I have nothing but respect and admiration for PG, but I don't think he gets to unilaterally decide the meaning of words. Wikipedia says a startup is "a partnership or temporary organization designed to search for a repeatable and scalable business model"[1]. The relevant Wiktionary entry defines it as a "new organization or business venture"[2], fairly similar to the OED's "newly established business" definition[3]. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Startup_company https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Startup_company [2] http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/startup http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/startup [3] http://www.oxforddictionaries.com/us/definition/american_english/start-up http://www.oxforddictionaries.com/us/definition/american_eng...
    - kyleashipley 12y ago
      As a counterpoint, the Wikipedia definition of startup was coined by Steve Blank sometime in the past ~5 years, so it's not exactly ancient history. I think if we place emphasis on the word "scalable," PG + Blank's definitions are compatible. Both distinguish "startup" from "new company." I don't think most people would categorize building a tech company and starting a hair salon as the same activity because of the force multiplier of scale.
rquantz 12y ago
I can do one better. I went to a job fair type event with one of the cofounders of the company, and I was pushing a very qualified woman we met there. The cofounder told me, with a very thoughtful look on his face, "I'm not sexist... but I just don't like working with women."

x0x0 12y ago

I work at startups at the valley. I was briefly employed at one that was sending candidates a code test that involved printing a picture of a naked woman (in ascii art, but naked nonetheless). In mid-2014. From a cto who was a senior manager at google and presumably took at least one sexual harassment class.

RyJones 12y ago
The HR guy in the sexual harassment videos you had to watch every two years at Microsoft was fired for sexual harassment. No amount of training seems to overcome base desire.
- pjlegato 12y ago
  It's not about base desires, it's that some people are simply assholes. No amount of training will overcome someone's asshole nature. There is a prevalent and totally erroneous school of thought which naively assumes that people do bad things simply because they don't know any better, and so all you have to do is take them aside as you would a misbehaving kindergartener for some "training" and then all will be well. It doesn't work that way. Some people are just assholes and always will be, irrespective of any amount of "training" you give them.
  - RyJones 12y ago
    You're right. I made a facile comment in haste and I was wrong.
  - thecage411 12y ago
    I don't think that school of thought is actually prevelant. They make you go to training classes so if there is a lawsuit they can point to all the training and say it's the individual's fault, not the company's.
  - aptwebapps 12y ago
    Some people, sure. But I don't think everyone who misbehaves is irredeemable.

MCRed 12y ago

For me, it's a huge signal when a founder or exec at a startup mentions an ivy league school or a "marquee" name. I've worked for big names in tech, I don't go around bragging about it. Only time to brag is if you were a cofounder of the company you're referring to. Who hasn't worked for a Google/Amazon/Microsoft/Apple/Facebook/etc? You worked at goldman? Ok, so I'm to take from that the assumption that you're entitled and incompetent to be leading a tech startup? Good to know. You went to Harvard? And you think this is relevant? So you care about pedigree more than competence? We can expect nepotism as you hire your friends? Good to know. These are great services they are offering-- you know not to take the job.

inthewoods 12y ago
Sign of the end for the startup economy imho - I remember during the first dot com bubble that when the consultants/MBAs starting doing startups (broadly) it was time to pack it up. Not that all MBAs or consultants are bad - but it isn't a good sign. Like a great party that has been discovered by the assh*les. I hope I'm wrong, but man, it feels familiar.
GFischer 12y ago
Well, in Uruguay, if you get to Facebook or Google or Apple, you literally make the news: http://www.elpais.com.uy/vida-actual/felipe-primer-uruguayo-que-trabajara-facebook.html http://www.elpais.com.uy/vida-actual/felipe-primer-uruguayo-... That's the biggest newspaper in the country, which incorrectly identified the first Uruguayan who worked for Facebook. Interestingly, there are quite a few Uruguayans at Microsoft, and I think there are a couple at Google.

bane 12y ago

I was on a team trying to setup a spinout company in Australia of all places. My corporate overlords built a team, boy band style, to go investigate the market with a minimum product, really experienced people who had seen and done a lot. About half the team was on their second career after retiring out of their first, but all were brilliant. I think we added it up and there was something like 170 years of experience in my small group (I was by far the junior person on the team). During the sit down on the marketing meeting a new person was introduced to the team (not unusual). They came up to the group and was obviously another senior, experienced addition to the group, hopefully with a long and interesting career behind them. They walked up to the front of the group and introduced themselves, "Hi I'm <name>, I went to Yale" and sat down at the table and proceeded to offer nothing of any substance over the next 8 weeks until they were quietly asked to go "contribute" their Yale credentials somewhere else. I've been hit with every kind of credential wagging since then, "When I was at McKinsey..."* or "When I went to Harvard..."+ are usually immediate signs of an immensely useless person and I go out of my way to avoid them. It's actually kind of pathetic. The best people I've ever met actually seemed a bit shy about notable credentials in their past and it wasn't until after months of probing that I could finally learn about some cool job or notable place they went to school. * I wrote this before reading the article + seriously, it's like a cliche

notch90 12y ago
They should fire the co-founder. That is unacceptable behavior.
mhoad 12y ago
As an interesting side anecdote, I just spent the last 6 months living in Kenya with the same kind of Harvard / McKinsey style crowd except in the social enterprise / NGO space. As someone who was coming from a very different background to a lot of these people, I wasn't exactly sure what to expect. While I would be the first to admit that things are less than perfect in a number of ways, generally speaking the people I met and eventually ended up consulting for couldn't possibly be much further from some of the personalities described in a number of the comments here. Overall I was super impressed with the humility, the intelligence and the general standard that I saw in a lot of these people. Then again, there is a world of difference between someone who chooses to live on next to nothing in a 3rd world country where they are there primarily to help others and the types described in the article.

S4M 12y ago

>Oh, you went to Harvard 10 years ago? That's so relevant considering we just met 2 minutes ago! You used to work at Goldman and now you're doing a consumer-tech startup? Yeah, that really needed to be in the first 3 sentences you've ever spoken to me. I agree that it's a bit pointless to mention that you studied in a prestigious university, but unlike the other commenters I think it makes sense to say that you worked in a company that is reputed to pay well, because if you left that well paying job it means that you have high hopes for that startup. Of course it would be douchey to say "Hey, I am Sam, and I used to work at Goldman, so kneel in front of me!", but saying "I worked at Goldman but I believe there is more money to be made in the house cleaning space" is a sign of confidence in the company - something I would like to see in a founder.

personZ 12y ago
because if you left that well paying job If someone says that they worked at a well paying job, my suspicion would be that they were run out of it, doubly so if they were engaged with such a shoddy, rag tag start-up. It would take pretty strong evidence to the contrary to believe otherwise.

atomical 12y ago

Your last paragraph has me cracking up. It reminds me of Todd Barry's sarcastic delivery.

EliRivers 12y ago

"Shit, I literally just read a racist internal email an hour ago about the new cleaning lady at the office." Serious question. What did you do about it?