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And it's always a safe bet the top response to that comment will be somebody criticizing it without any solid facts or reason but with fuzzy "you just need to b

And it's always a safe bet the top response to that comment will be somebody criticizing it without any solid facts or reason but with fuzzy "you just need to believe harder!" kind of nonsense.

jsmthrowaway 12y ago
Actually, I subtly said "get the hell out of the way if you don't think it'll work," not warm and fuzzy smarminess. But it's much easier for you to mock if you read warm and fuzzies out of it, and I get that. What I said, reworded, was the people who sit on the sidelines of anything and tell you, while you are trying something, that it won't work are among the worst people in the profession. I didn't say believe harder. I don't give a damn what you believe and don't need you reminding me, constantly, that my project has a chance of failure. Keep it to yourself or get on board. That's my point. I am not a kind person, so that you'd ascribe feel-good nonsense to me is downright hilarious. I can handle it but a lot of people can't, and it's really, really tiring to keep a team from becoming demoralized when there's a naysayer popcorn gallery in every thread and watercooler discussion.
- Kalium 12y ago
  The naysayers do us all a valuable service. They remind us that hope, dreams, and belief do not solve engineering problems. You know what demoralizes a team like nothing else? And endless litany of projects that failed because nobody wanted to listen to the people pointing out problems.
  - genericuser 12y ago
    You know what demoralizes a team EXACTLY like that? When people on the team think they are pointing out problems, but are doing so without support, by simply saying "That won't work" instead of "That won't work because of ...". This does nothing to further a project and leaves the burden of proof for a working solution on the person who proposed the solution in the first place, and the way for them to prove their solution is to continue working on it, with no actionable feedback to revise their project on.
macinjosh 12y ago
It is also a safe bet that the response to the original comment's response will be some guy saying how being hopeful about something is complete nonsense. It's turtles all the way down. Guess we should just give up on Internet commenting. /s
- javajosh 12y ago
  Interestingly, the heat for this pattern is always taken by the last comment, for some strange reason. Maybe it's the communities way of saying "Duh, we know this happens, and the way we stop conversations from going down the meta-toilet is to not have them." Although I would say it's more fair to downvote every comment that fits the pattern, to the root, rather than just the latter ones.
  - krapp 12y ago
    >Although I would say it's more fair to downvote every comment that fits the pattern, to the root, rather than just the latter ones. That's a good way to lose your comment-voting privileges - I just noticed my ability to vote on comments disappeared at some point.

And it's always a safe bet the top response to that comment will be somebody criticizing it without any solid facts or reason but with fuzzy "you just need to believe harder!" kind of nonsense.

jsmthrowaway 12y ago

Actually, I subtly said "get the hell out of the way if you don't think it'll work," not warm and fuzzy smarminess. But it's much easier for you to mock if you read warm and fuzzies out of it, and I get that. What I said, reworded, was the people who sit on the sidelines of anything and tell you, while you are trying something, that it won't work are among the worst people in the profession. I didn't say believe harder. I don't give a damn what you believe and don't need you reminding me, constantly, that my project has a chance of failure. Keep it to yourself or get on board. That's my point. I am not a kind person, so that you'd ascribe feel-good nonsense to me is downright hilarious. I can handle it but a lot of people can't, and it's really, really tiring to keep a team from becoming demoralized when there's a naysayer popcorn gallery in every thread and watercooler discussion.

Kalium 12y ago
The naysayers do us all a valuable service. They remind us that hope, dreams, and belief do not solve engineering problems. You know what demoralizes a team like nothing else? And endless litany of projects that failed because nobody wanted to listen to the people pointing out problems.
- genericuser 12y ago
  You know what demoralizes a team EXACTLY like that? When people on the team think they are pointing out problems, but are doing so without support, by simply saying "That won't work" instead of "That won't work because of ...". This does nothing to further a project and leaves the burden of proof for a working solution on the person who proposed the solution in the first place, and the way for them to prove their solution is to continue working on it, with no actionable feedback to revise their project on.

macinjosh 12y ago

It is also a safe bet that the response to the original comment's response will be some guy saying how being hopeful about something is complete nonsense. It's turtles all the way down. Guess we should just give up on Internet commenting. /s

javajosh 12y ago
Interestingly, the heat for this pattern is always taken by the last comment, for some strange reason. Maybe it's the communities way of saying "Duh, we know this happens, and the way we stop conversations from going down the meta-toilet is to not have them." Although I would say it's more fair to downvote every comment that fits the pattern, to the root, rather than just the latter ones.
- krapp 12y ago
  >Although I would say it's more fair to downvote every comment that fits the pattern, to the root, rather than just the latter ones. That's a good way to lose your comment-voting privileges - I just noticed my ability to vote on comments disappeared at some point.