> You getting punished when your own stuff breaks is more a small business issue, not something corporations have. why do you think that should be the case? I'

> You getting punished when your own stuff breaks is more a small business issue, not something corporations have. why do you think that should be the case? I'd argue quite the opposite having done this in a large corporation with pretty decent success. to be successful, it requires that your monitoring isn't noisy; most issues are repaired in an automated way; then when you get a "page" it is something that someone deeply familiar with the code / service is the best person to react to it. it will drive down the MTTR. and it typically gets the root cause fixed sooner in the code. these folks need to be engineers, but they don't all need to be just the devs, since internet scale services just are noisy and you need to have some randomization buffer. but those engineers need to be dedicated to the service and not a central org, where they aren't going to know how to look at logs, have depth on the intra-service interactions, the latest changes, etc. to me, this is also the best definition of "devops".