5 ms·

Long story short - you did it the wrong way. systemd on debian tries to reuse far too many /etc/init.d scripts, whose quality and performance I find questionab

by guylhem 12y ago

Long story short - you did it the wrong way. systemd on debian tries to reuse far too many /etc/init.d scripts, whose quality and performance I find questionable. Follow the guide on http://www.holgerschurig.de/linux/systemd.html http://www.holgerschurig.de/linux/systemd.html to get a good experience. You can also use my scripts (cf http://libreboot.org/docs/future/#fastboot http://libreboot.org/docs/future/#fastboot) to compile your systemd For the specific zfs problem, I can't say for sure (I use xfs), but a simple script you wrote yourself is usually the best. I also had fstab related errors for swap (I use luks) until I disabled the automatic stuff and wrote a replacement script. systemd is well done and such fixes don't take long, once you understand the logic of it. (usually a symlink to /dev/null to disable the script and a few lines of ascii text for the replacement) My results: on a thinkpad x60 (2006 era laptop), after coreboot, I boot in about 3 seconds, cf http://www.coreboot.org/pipermail/coreboot/2014-July/078215.html http://www.coreboot.org/pipermail/coreboot/2014-July/078215.... (link to a youtube video of another person doing the same thing). Suspend works very well out of the box, and even better (ex: renewing dhcp leases) after adding a few scripts. systemd makes many things possible and easy, but with debian at least, the out-of-the-box experience has to be improved. Nothing impossible if you have say a day to spare to learn how systemd works and write your fixes.

VLM 12y ago
"if you have say a day to spare" Going to take lifetimes of single tasking / blocking task reboots to run a net profit off that investment of time.
- hamburglar 12y ago
  Seriously. Number of days I have allocated to fixing a broken init system after my next dist upgrade: 0
nknighthb 12y ago
Time and again proponents of systemd belittled those of us with compatibility concerns and assured us of its compatibility[0] with existing scripts and setups. Now that it's been adopted, using that supposed compatibility is "doing it wrong". Imagine my surprise. [0] http://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Software/systemd/ http://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Software/systemd/ ("compatible with SysV and LSB init scripts", "It can work as a drop-in replacement for sysvinit.")
- CoffeeDregs 12y ago
  Now that it's been adopted, using that supposed compatibility is "doing it wrong". It has only been adopted in non-Stable distributions of Debian... I haven't seen anyone belittle anyone over "compatibility concerns"; I have seen folks belittled (especially in this thread) when they complain about imperfect stability in distributions which are not Stable. At the risk of appealing to authority, I'd be interest to see posts from Debian/Ubuntu maintainers in which they express frustration at the various problems systemd is causing them. I haven't seen any and would appreciate hearing from them or getting some links to their posts. EDIT: clarified area of "belittlement"...
  - nisa 12y ago
    From the "About" page on complete.org (OP): > I am a developer for the Debian GNU/Linux operating system, and have been since the late 1990s
  - nknighthb 12y ago
    You said elsewhere: > I run Debian Testing and was able to upgrade ~5 machines without a hitch. So which is it? Is systemd in Debian hitch-free or not? Or do you only care about your own systems and no one else's? > I have seen folks belittled Meaning you've already lost the argument. > I'd be interest to see posts from Debian/Ubuntu maintainers Yeah. Screw users, right? systemd, land of ever-shifting rhetoric. You guys should get out of the software development business and run for Congress.
    - bkor 12y ago
      It seems you're rather upset with people who like systemd. That's fine. However, you're putting a lot of words into my mouth. I like systemd. According to you because I like systemd: - my opinion is "screw users" - belittled you with compatibility concerns - arguments are nothing more than rhetoric. I find such discussion style rather poor. Instead of diving people into pro/con or black/white (with us or against us), try expressing things a bit more granular. Further, it seems you're out to win arguments by selectively quoting and changing the meaning of what you've quoted. If there are bugs in systemd, they have to be fixed. I'm one of the biggest systemd advocates. This combined proves you are incorrect on what people liking systemd say or suggest.

by guylhem 12y ago

VLM 12y ago

"if you have say a day to spare" Going to take lifetimes of single tasking / blocking task reboots to run a net profit off that investment of time.

hamburglar 12y ago
Seriously. Number of days I have allocated to fixing a broken init system after my next dist upgrade: 0

nknighthb 12y ago

Time and again proponents of systemd belittled those of us with compatibility concerns and assured us of its compatibility[0] with existing scripts and setups. Now that it's been adopted, using that supposed compatibility is "doing it wrong". Imagine my surprise. [0] http://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Software/systemd/ http://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Software/systemd/ ("compatible with SysV and LSB init scripts", "It can work as a drop-in replacement for sysvinit.")

CoffeeDregs 12y ago
Now that it's been adopted, using that supposed compatibility is "doing it wrong". It has only been adopted in non-Stable distributions of Debian... I haven't seen anyone belittle anyone over "compatibility concerns"; I have seen folks belittled (especially in this thread) when they complain about imperfect stability in distributions which are not Stable. At the risk of appealing to authority, I'd be interest to see posts from Debian/Ubuntu maintainers in which they express frustration at the various problems systemd is causing them. I haven't seen any and would appreciate hearing from them or getting some links to their posts. EDIT: clarified area of "belittlement"...
- nisa 12y ago
  From the "About" page on complete.org (OP): > I am a developer for the Debian GNU/Linux operating system, and have been since the late 1990s
- nknighthb 12y ago
  You said elsewhere: > I run Debian Testing and was able to upgrade ~5 machines without a hitch. So which is it? Is systemd in Debian hitch-free or not? Or do you only care about your own systems and no one else's? > I have seen folks belittled Meaning you've already lost the argument. > I'd be interest to see posts from Debian/Ubuntu maintainers Yeah. Screw users, right? systemd, land of ever-shifting rhetoric. You guys should get out of the software development business and run for Congress.
  - bkor 12y ago
    It seems you're rather upset with people who like systemd. That's fine. However, you're putting a lot of words into my mouth. I like systemd. According to you because I like systemd: - my opinion is "screw users" - belittled you with compatibility concerns - arguments are nothing more than rhetoric. I find such discussion style rather poor. Instead of diving people into pro/con or black/white (with us or against us), try expressing things a bit more granular. Further, it seems you're out to win arguments by selectively quoting and changing the meaning of what you've quoted. If there are bugs in systemd, they have to be fixed. I'm one of the biggest systemd advocates. This combined proves you are incorrect on what people liking systemd say or suggest.