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The HN title is total flame bait and does not match the actual post title on either LtU or Vimeo; a mod should really change it. It may also make sense to chang

The HN title is total flame bait and does not match the actual post title on either LtU or Vimeo; a mod should really change it. It may also make sense to change the link to the Vimeo presentation as linking to the LtU discussion forces people to click through to see anything and is a little strange – are we supposed to watch the video or read the LtU thread?

david927 12y ago
The title isn't flame bait. This really is the future of programming, in my opinion. The link is to LtU because I submitted it once before as a direct link and it wasn't upvoted. I couldn't submit that link again directly.
- chrisan 12y ago
  > This really is the future of programming, in my opinion. That is exactly why it is flame bait :)
  - david927 12y ago
    You're welcome to think the future of programming consists of typing into text documents; I think it looks more like using a spreadsheet. You're welcome to think the compiler and syntax are important; I think it's visualizations. You're welcome to think the future is a grandchild of C; I think we haven't even begun the journey yet.
    - haimez 12y ago
      You're going to want to work on your communication if you want to evangelize your new tool and not alienate people. For the rest of the world, the value of Kaya is not a given and you're going to get a lot of practice explaining it.
      - vixin 12y ago
        I'm 'people' as well and am not alienated. Nothing to stop you offering a mini-lecture on PR but for myself, rather you didn't. I can make up my own mind on Kaya as presented.
    - StefanKarpinski 12y ago
      Crap like this makes me actively not want to listen to you and reflects badly on Kaya. If you want to effectively promote something, give an honest account of its advantages and drawbacks and let people judge for themselves whether it's going to be the future of programming or not. The presenter of this talk understands that and doesn't try to oversell it, simply describing Kaya as "declarative reactive"; you should respect this and not make their work look crankish because of the way you, not they, choose to present it.
      - _deh 12y ago
        I suspect he is the presenter. But agree totally - the tone of the talk works 100% better.
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- zak_mc_kracken 12y ago
  Being the author, of course you'd say that. The fact that you actually believe that is a big red flag to me, especially when you refuse to put your argument in a written form.
MichaelGG 12y ago
For easy access: The link to the video is: http://vimeo.com/107069470 http://vimeo.com/107069470 (Some HNers just look at the comments first, so this might be useful for someone.)
- scroy 12y ago
  And since the post now links to Vimeo, here is the LtU link: http://lambda-the-ultimate.org/node/5054 http://lambda-the-ultimate.org/node/5054
  - dang 12y ago
    Yes, a moderator changed the url from that, and the title from "Kaya: The Future of Programming" in the hope that it would nudge the discussion back on-topic.
    - david927 12y ago
      Thanks, Dan (or whichever mod did that). You saved the thread.
fnordsensei 12y ago
True. I read the "future of programming" part as someone being really excited rather than accurate though. Although the future of programming is probably declarative once we stop doing it ourselves and leave the implementation details to the AI writing the program for us.
bryanlarsen 12y ago
This is a presentation of Kaya at the Future of Programming Workshop. The title is accurate. Shortened in a clickbait fashion, perhaps, but not "total flame bait".

david927 12y ago

The title isn't flame bait. This really is the future of programming, in my opinion. The link is to LtU because I submitted it once before as a direct link and it wasn't upvoted. I couldn't submit that link again directly.

chrisan 12y ago
> This really is the future of programming, in my opinion. That is exactly why it is flame bait :)
- david927 12y ago
  You're welcome to think the future of programming consists of typing into text documents; I think it looks more like using a spreadsheet. You're welcome to think the compiler and syntax are important; I think it's visualizations. You're welcome to think the future is a grandchild of C; I think we haven't even begun the journey yet.
  - haimez 12y ago
    You're going to want to work on your communication if you want to evangelize your new tool and not alienate people. For the rest of the world, the value of Kaya is not a given and you're going to get a lot of practice explaining it.
    - vixin 12y ago
      I'm 'people' as well and am not alienated. Nothing to stop you offering a mini-lecture on PR but for myself, rather you didn't. I can make up my own mind on Kaya as presented.
  - StefanKarpinski 12y ago
    Crap like this makes me actively not want to listen to you and reflects badly on Kaya. If you want to effectively promote something, give an honest account of its advantages and drawbacks and let people judge for themselves whether it's going to be the future of programming or not. The presenter of this talk understands that and doesn't try to oversell it, simply describing Kaya as "declarative reactive"; you should respect this and not make their work look crankish because of the way you, not they, choose to present it.
    - _deh 12y ago
      I suspect he is the presenter. But agree totally - the tone of the talk works 100% better.
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zak_mc_kracken 12y ago
Being the author, of course you'd say that. The fact that you actually believe that is a big red flag to me, especially when you refuse to put your argument in a written form.

MichaelGG 12y ago

For easy access: The link to the video is: http://vimeo.com/107069470 http://vimeo.com/107069470 (Some HNers just look at the comments first, so this might be useful for someone.)

scroy 12y ago
And since the post now links to Vimeo, here is the LtU link: http://lambda-the-ultimate.org/node/5054 http://lambda-the-ultimate.org/node/5054
- dang 12y ago
  Yes, a moderator changed the url from that, and the title from "Kaya: The Future of Programming" in the hope that it would nudge the discussion back on-topic.
  - david927 12y ago
    Thanks, Dan (or whichever mod did that). You saved the thread.

fnordsensei 12y ago

True. I read the "future of programming" part as someone being really excited rather than accurate though. Although the future of programming is probably declarative once we stop doing it ourselves and leave the implementation details to the AI writing the program for us.

bryanlarsen 12y ago

This is a presentation of Kaya at the Future of Programming Workshop. The title is accurate. Shortened in a clickbait fashion, perhaps, but not "total flame bait".