5 ms·

I see a huge number of comments on this thread implying that carefulness is related to the road danger. It's the perceived danger that matters. You don't need t

by capcah 12y ago

I see a huge number of comments on this thread implying that carefulness is related to the road danger. It's the perceived danger that matters. You don't need to make the roads more dangerous, just need to make them look so. I'm not from USA, and on the last time I visited it, I noticed how recklessly people drive on the highways, most of them were on the phone, eating, or doing something else(there was even a lady fixing her hair with her right hand, talking on the cellphone with her left hand and holding the steering wheel with her elbow, that freaked me out). If those people behave the same driving on a street, I can see that being the cause of the majority of accidents, since the reaction time for events will be smaller, since most occurrences happen within a few meters of the car. Finally, I know that this is not the focus of the article, but the USA cities need to focus more on the people that either cannot or will not(like me) drive. LA, LV and Miami, for instance, were pretty hellish until I finally gave in and rented a car, with poor public transportation and pedestrian access.

click170 12y ago
I'm frequently surprised by the lack of sidewalks everywhere outside of the downtown core of many cities. Perhaps its different in cities I haven't been to, but compared to where I grew up in, it does seem like everywhere else is car-first. Its not just the states or even big cities, I've lived in a small town in Ontario that was similar. It makes me wonder if its related to the age of the area. Newer areas seem to have more sidewalks.
- marcus_holmes 12y ago
  I visited San Diego (I was living in the UK at the time, and found it impossible to get anywhere. I was routinely told that only poor people caught the bus (and it could be dangerous), and there were no pavements anywhere to walk on. I walked to the nearest burger place for lunch every day, a hellish 1-mile jaunt through rubbish-strewn wasteland getting beeped at every time I tried to cross a road. In contrast, every European and Australian city I've lived in has catered for pedestrians and cyclists to the extent that it's at least possible to walk or bike anywhere you need to go (even if it would take hours in these huge Aussie cities). I still wonder at it. How do Americans feel about living in such a shitty environment?
  - UrMomReadsHN 12y ago
    I hate the "only poor people take the bus" vile bullshit prejudice and I've seen it here on Hacker News as well. "America" however is not one environment and is INCREDIBLY diverse. There are places such as you've described in the US as well. Not everywhere has such prejudice against public transit too. However I believe as a whole the US is (or at least was) moving in general to a society that revolves around the automobile. I'll tell you the absolute worst part of not being in an automobile is for me (as a woman) - the form of street harassment where assholes either beep at you or yell comments at you out the window going by. This has been a huge issue for me in every American city I ever lived in. Somehow people think this is appropriate behavior. It makes me not want to walk in a walkable area.
  - praneshp 12y ago
    Where in San Diego were you? I am wondering if there is a place in that beautiful city that is rubbish strewn. It's got horrible public transport though, agreed.
    - marcus_holmes 12y ago
      It was a few years ago, so things may have changed. I was out in the suburbs a bit, staying with a friend (who worked and therefore couldn't give me lifts everywhere). The wasteland looked like it was eventually going to be more suburb, but wasn't actually a building site. I did find it weird that there were these patches of the city where just nothing was built. British cities are incredibly compact - if it's not built on or being built on then it's a manicured public park, usually fenced. But Aussie cities have odd areas that are just empty, too... must be the relative age of the cities that causes this.
    - dredmorbius 12y ago
      San Diego is a huge city in land area, 325 square miles -- 18 miles square. The actual geography is rather more varied than that: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/San_Diego#mediaviewer/File:San_Diego_County_California_Incorporated_and_Unincorporated_areas_San_Diego_Highlighted.svg http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/San_Diego#mediaviewer/File:San_... There are parts of it which are rather other than "beautiful".
rconti 12y ago
Las Vegas is perhaps the worst city on the planet for the carless. I've had many amusing incidents of attempting to walk places, where not just sidewalks, but roads simply do no go through. LV, LA, and Miami are particularly appalling examples of US cities which have terrible pedestrian access. That said, I've never seen as many people talking on their phone while driving as I saw last month in Reykjavik.

by capcah 12y ago

click170 12y ago

I'm frequently surprised by the lack of sidewalks everywhere outside of the downtown core of many cities. Perhaps its different in cities I haven't been to, but compared to where I grew up in, it does seem like everywhere else is car-first. Its not just the states or even big cities, I've lived in a small town in Ontario that was similar. It makes me wonder if its related to the age of the area. Newer areas seem to have more sidewalks.

marcus_holmes 12y ago
I visited San Diego (I was living in the UK at the time, and found it impossible to get anywhere. I was routinely told that only poor people caught the bus (and it could be dangerous), and there were no pavements anywhere to walk on. I walked to the nearest burger place for lunch every day, a hellish 1-mile jaunt through rubbish-strewn wasteland getting beeped at every time I tried to cross a road. In contrast, every European and Australian city I've lived in has catered for pedestrians and cyclists to the extent that it's at least possible to walk or bike anywhere you need to go (even if it would take hours in these huge Aussie cities). I still wonder at it. How do Americans feel about living in such a shitty environment?
- UrMomReadsHN 12y ago
  I hate the "only poor people take the bus" vile bullshit prejudice and I've seen it here on Hacker News as well. "America" however is not one environment and is INCREDIBLY diverse. There are places such as you've described in the US as well. Not everywhere has such prejudice against public transit too. However I believe as a whole the US is (or at least was) moving in general to a society that revolves around the automobile. I'll tell you the absolute worst part of not being in an automobile is for me (as a woman) - the form of street harassment where assholes either beep at you or yell comments at you out the window going by. This has been a huge issue for me in every American city I ever lived in. Somehow people think this is appropriate behavior. It makes me not want to walk in a walkable area.
- praneshp 12y ago
  Where in San Diego were you? I am wondering if there is a place in that beautiful city that is rubbish strewn. It's got horrible public transport though, agreed.
  - marcus_holmes 12y ago
    It was a few years ago, so things may have changed. I was out in the suburbs a bit, staying with a friend (who worked and therefore couldn't give me lifts everywhere). The wasteland looked like it was eventually going to be more suburb, but wasn't actually a building site. I did find it weird that there were these patches of the city where just nothing was built. British cities are incredibly compact - if it's not built on or being built on then it's a manicured public park, usually fenced. But Aussie cities have odd areas that are just empty, too... must be the relative age of the cities that causes this.
  - dredmorbius 12y ago
    San Diego is a huge city in land area, 325 square miles -- 18 miles square. The actual geography is rather more varied than that: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/San_Diego#mediaviewer/File:San_Diego_County_California_Incorporated_and_Unincorporated_areas_San_Diego_Highlighted.svg http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/San_Diego#mediaviewer/File:San_... There are parts of it which are rather other than "beautiful".

rconti 12y ago

Las Vegas is perhaps the worst city on the planet for the carless. I've had many amusing incidents of attempting to walk places, where not just sidewalks, but roads simply do no go through. LV, LA, and Miami are particularly appalling examples of US cities which have terrible pedestrian access. That said, I've never seen as many people talking on their phone while driving as I saw last month in Reykjavik.