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And yet the Docklands Light Railway, also in London, and also under TfL control (though operation is outsourced to Serco, soon to be Keolis/Amey) has run withou
by yangyang 12y ago
And yet the Docklands Light Railway, also in London, and also under TfL control (though operation is outsourced to Serco, soon to be Keolis/Amey) has run without drivers (but with "train captains") for its entire history, over 25 years. And it does travel underground in places.
- stuaxo 12y agoDid they always have train captains ? I know there have been incidents (like a gang of kids chasing someone onto the tracks to be run over), that might have made them introduce "train captains".
- colinramsay 12y agoAccording to Wikipedia they've always had them. Doesn't having someone like this on the train mean it's not really "driverless"?
- yangyang 12y agoTo a point. They walk up and down the train, do the door opening / closing, check tickets here and there, and occasionally drive the train (though it always seems painfully slow when under manual control). I don't know how they'd do it on the tube. Presumably door closing would still require manual control.
- masklinn 12y ago> Presumably door closing would still require manual control. What for? The doors can be on a timer (station-specific if necessary)
- untog 12y agoPeople getting stuck in doors, holding doors open, etc. etc. - though I wonder if it would be more efficient to have a person per train or a person per platform for that.
- yangyang 12y agoIndeed - quite a lot of stations already have platform staff for checking doors and notifying the driver that it's OK to close. I suppose it would depend on the ratio of active trains to stations as it which is most efficient. I believe TfL have committed to manning all stations after the closure of ticket offices so having platform dispatch staff may be a useful use of labour.
- untog 12y agoThat did occur to me after I posted - someone on the platform would be much more useful - able to directions to people, etc.
- mynameisvlad 12y agoVancouver's Canada Line (fully automated) opens the doors fully and then tries to slowly close them if it detects an obstruction. A similar system could be in place.
- yangyang 12y agoThey'd probably never close in some stations, like Victoria at rush hour :-)
- mynameisvlad 12y agoYeah there's attendants at every station, they're just not always out on the platforms. I've seen them bitch people out for doing it. There's also announcements really frequently telling people not to hold doors.
- clarkdave 12y agoI asked a PSA why it's slow and she told me that when under manual operation the train is "off the grid", so to speak, and is speed limited for safety reasons (other trains no longer know where it is) The door closing works well for the DLR -- the PSA checks all the doors are clear and then shuts them all at once. This probably isn't viable for a tube because platforms are smaller and more congested.
- iaskwhy 12y agoJust an anecdote: I use the DLR multiple times per day and after a few years using it I finally got stuck on a door the other day. I pushed the button to open the door, it started opening and when it was around 80% opened, I was entering the carriage, when it suddenly closed really fast. I got sandwiched on my shoulders and then on my right foot. The door didn't open, I had to force myself to remove the damn foot painfully. It did hurt. Can't imagine what could happen if it was someone weaker (like a child or an elderly). Oh, and my red snickers turned black.
- yangyang 12y agoThey definitely had them before that incident (which was at Shadwell IIRC).
- quarterto 12y agoSideburnsOfDoom mentioned that: > Driverless trains work well enough on the DLR in East London, and are probably an inevitable step in 21st century London.
- yangyang 12y agoHe / she edited after I replied.
- SideburnsOfDoom 12y agoMy apologies. Most of my edits are to fix typos or for sentence clarity, but I did add that part just after submitting the first version.