4 ms·

Can someone help me understand if this is a big deal?

by kelukelugames 12y ago

huhtenberg 12y ago
It's not. It's the reputation damage control, largely superficial.
- TD-Linux 12y ago
  It's awfully expensive damage control, though.
- nullrouted 12y ago
  Geez, Why do people here have to be so cynical? Twitter is doing a good thing here arguing that the government saying they can't release NSL number they are restricting free speech, which is completely true. Releasing these numbers pose no threat to national security and just shows the DOJs scorched earth policy when it comes to defending their perceived powers. This is a great thing for Twitter to do and it should be praised for doing so, not be given cynical/snarky replies.
  - huhtenberg 12y ago
    "Geez" ? Twitter is a business. Whatever they do is preceded by the expenses vs benefits analysis. In this case the only benefit is an improvement of their public reputation. They want to disassociate themselves with the state surveillance machine. However this lawsuit means an absolute zilch in terms of an actual surveillance issue. Nor does it move a needle on the very fact that there NSLs exist to begin with. It serves no public interest, it doesn't change things and it's asking not just for peanuts, it's asking for the dust off the peanuts shells. It's a farce. Just as you said - releasing these numbers is a non-issue, so the government will resist for a while and then it will yield. Everyone will cheer for Twitter and the victory, but things will remain exactly where they are now. The only reason why this lawsuit exists is to improve public's perception of Twitter. It's a PR stunt. I don't see what they should be commended for.
    - nullrouted 12y ago
      Yes "Geez" Look I get it, you don't think what Twitter is doing adds any value and thats great but in reality you are just being smug and not really adding any value to the conversation. You are just trying to spread your smug dim view of the world and you aren't really helping anything by doing so. Instead of always looking for the negative or the cynical view in things like this like "Well they are just doing this for the PR", why not look at it and say "This is awesome that a company is fighting in court to release this type of information to the public." It really will change your view of the world if you start looking at positive and will improve your life dramatically. Twitter is doing something here that they don't really have to do because they could just go along with the other big companies, follow the guidelines the government laid out and no one would say anything. They have gone further to demand to release exact numbers and more importantly are fighting to stop the government's practice of being able to gag companies in these situations. It may be a small step but it is a first step and they should be commended for it no matter the motive. Good for them and I thank them for picking this fight for all of us.
      - huhtenberg 12y ago
        I don't follow. Are you saying that cynical views don't belong to the HN because they don't "add any value to conversation"? Did I get that right? > Instead of always looking for the negative or the cynical view in things like this like "Well they are just doing this for the PR", why not look at it and say "This is awesome that a company is fighting in court to release this type of information to the public." It really will change your view of the world if you start looking at positive and will improve your life dramatically. Patronizing, misguided, but very deep. Must be from the early Dr. Phil, right?
stringray 12y ago
I think people wanting others to tell them what is and isn't a big deal seeds some of the biggest problems in the western world.
- tetrep 12y ago
  I think the implication here is that kelukelugames doesn't think it's a big deal, and is asking others for input without explicitly taking a side.
  - kelukelugames 12y ago
    I like Twitter and I think it's interesting whenever a big company sues the US government. I wanted to see everyone else's reactions.
- chc 12y ago
  I think people jumping to conclusions about what is or isn't a big deal is one of the biggest problems of the Internet.
smutticus 12y ago
Twitter wants to be able to say how many NSLs they've received with more preciseness. The government says they can only be vague, they want to be more precise. I think it would be a 'big deal' if Twitter and other companies started reporting the exact amount of NSLs they receive when they receive them. That would be great. Whether this lawsuit will result in that, even if Twitter wins, is not clear.
fleitz 12y ago
If you believe that justice must not only be done but be seen to be done then yes, if you don't then it doesn't matter. But really, trials and the rule of law are so 2000.

Can someone help me understand if this is a big deal?

huhtenberg 12y ago

It's not. It's the reputation damage control, largely superficial.

TD-Linux 12y ago
It's awfully expensive damage control, though.
nullrouted 12y ago
Geez, Why do people here have to be so cynical? Twitter is doing a good thing here arguing that the government saying they can't release NSL number they are restricting free speech, which is completely true. Releasing these numbers pose no threat to national security and just shows the DOJs scorched earth policy when it comes to defending their perceived powers. This is a great thing for Twitter to do and it should be praised for doing so, not be given cynical/snarky replies.
- huhtenberg 12y ago
  "Geez" ? Twitter is a business. Whatever they do is preceded by the expenses vs benefits analysis. In this case the only benefit is an improvement of their public reputation. They want to disassociate themselves with the state surveillance machine. However this lawsuit means an absolute zilch in terms of an actual surveillance issue. Nor does it move a needle on the very fact that there NSLs exist to begin with. It serves no public interest, it doesn't change things and it's asking not just for peanuts, it's asking for the dust off the peanuts shells. It's a farce. Just as you said - releasing these numbers is a non-issue, so the government will resist for a while and then it will yield. Everyone will cheer for Twitter and the victory, but things will remain exactly where they are now. The only reason why this lawsuit exists is to improve public's perception of Twitter. It's a PR stunt. I don't see what they should be commended for.
  - nullrouted 12y ago
    Yes "Geez" Look I get it, you don't think what Twitter is doing adds any value and thats great but in reality you are just being smug and not really adding any value to the conversation. You are just trying to spread your smug dim view of the world and you aren't really helping anything by doing so. Instead of always looking for the negative or the cynical view in things like this like "Well they are just doing this for the PR", why not look at it and say "This is awesome that a company is fighting in court to release this type of information to the public." It really will change your view of the world if you start looking at positive and will improve your life dramatically. Twitter is doing something here that they don't really have to do because they could just go along with the other big companies, follow the guidelines the government laid out and no one would say anything. They have gone further to demand to release exact numbers and more importantly are fighting to stop the government's practice of being able to gag companies in these situations. It may be a small step but it is a first step and they should be commended for it no matter the motive. Good for them and I thank them for picking this fight for all of us.
    - huhtenberg 12y ago
      I don't follow. Are you saying that cynical views don't belong to the HN because they don't "add any value to conversation"? Did I get that right? > Instead of always looking for the negative or the cynical view in things like this like "Well they are just doing this for the PR", why not look at it and say "This is awesome that a company is fighting in court to release this type of information to the public." It really will change your view of the world if you start looking at positive and will improve your life dramatically. Patronizing, misguided, but very deep. Must be from the early Dr. Phil, right?

stringray 12y ago

I think people wanting others to tell them what is and isn't a big deal seeds some of the biggest problems in the western world.

tetrep 12y ago
I think the implication here is that kelukelugames doesn't think it's a big deal, and is asking others for input without explicitly taking a side.
- kelukelugames 12y ago
  I like Twitter and I think it's interesting whenever a big company sues the US government. I wanted to see everyone else's reactions.
chc 12y ago
I think people jumping to conclusions about what is or isn't a big deal is one of the biggest problems of the Internet.

smutticus 12y ago

Twitter wants to be able to say how many NSLs they've received with more preciseness. The government says they can only be vague, they want to be more precise. I think it would be a 'big deal' if Twitter and other companies started reporting the exact amount of NSLs they receive when they receive them. That would be great. Whether this lawsuit will result in that, even if Twitter wins, is not clear.

fleitz 12y ago

If you believe that justice must not only be done but be seen to be done then yes, if you don't then it doesn't matter. But really, trials and the rule of law are so 2000.