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Congrats on downvoting a legitimate reply. If this is what people around here do once they get this ability I shouldn't even bother writing anything. And it is

by yaeger 12y ago

Congrats on downvoting a legitimate reply. If this is what people around here do once they get this ability I shouldn't even bother writing anything. And it is still people behaving as a child when they should pay for education that will further their careers. I hope they have fun using overhead projectors that are already 40 years old for the next couple of decades!

pluma 12y ago
Did you imply I'm downvoting? I don't even have enough karma (or whatever else the limitation is based on) to downvote you -- not that I would see any reason to do so in the first place. > And it is still people behaving as a child when they should pay for education that will further their careers. See? That's the problem right there. University in Germany (originally) isn't about career advancement. It's about education and lifelong learning. This is what I tried to explain. You can say this ideal is silly, but that doesn't change the fact that this ideal exists and a lot of students protesting the fees (and BA/MA, and so on) were genuinely subscribing to it. That aside, in Germany most job education (Berufsausbildung, as in, an internship at a company coupled with classroom education) is government-subsidized and you're paid for it. So it's not like tuition fees were about making people pay for learning a trade -- it was exclusively about universities (under the assumption that university degrees mean higher income -- which is ridiculous if you consider the job market for nearly all of the degrees that aren't in high demand or relevant to any career, e.g. linguistics, cultural studies, philosophy etc). > I hope they have fun using overhead projectors that are already 40 years old for the next couple of decades! The government reducing their spending on public education is irrelevant to the debate of tuition fees. If the universities need more money to do their job, the government can increase the spending. This already exists, tuition fees were the new thing, not public funding. And the reduction of public funding was decidedly not brought up as an argument when the fees were introduced -- in fact it was claimed this would not have any effect on it.

by yaeger 12y ago

pluma 12y ago

Did you imply I'm downvoting? I don't even have enough karma (or whatever else the limitation is based on) to downvote you -- not that I would see any reason to do so in the first place. > And it is still people behaving as a child when they should pay for education that will further their careers. See? That's the problem right there. University in Germany (originally) isn't about career advancement. It's about education and lifelong learning. This is what I tried to explain. You can say this ideal is silly, but that doesn't change the fact that this ideal exists and a lot of students protesting the fees (and BA/MA, and so on) were genuinely subscribing to it. That aside, in Germany most job education (Berufsausbildung, as in, an internship at a company coupled with classroom education) is government-subsidized and you're paid for it. So it's not like tuition fees were about making people pay for learning a trade -- it was exclusively about universities (under the assumption that university degrees mean higher income -- which is ridiculous if you consider the job market for nearly all of the degrees that aren't in high demand or relevant to any career, e.g. linguistics, cultural studies, philosophy etc). > I hope they have fun using overhead projectors that are already 40 years old for the next couple of decades! The government reducing their spending on public education is irrelevant to the debate of tuition fees. If the universities need more money to do their job, the government can increase the spending. This already exists, tuition fees were the new thing, not public funding. And the reduction of public funding was decidedly not brought up as an argument when the fees were introduced -- in fact it was claimed this would not have any effect on it.