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I'm also really disappointed with this announcement. I had been putting off learning Emacs because I told myself "don't bother, give ibdknox and friends some ti

I'm also really disappointed with this announcement. I had been putting off learning Emacs because I told myself "don't bother, give ibdknox and friends some time to put some polish on LightTable, and you'll have a modern Emacs". Looks like it's time to dive into Emacs...

muraiki 12y ago
I just got back into using Clojure after a bit of a hiatus (and after having learned vim). I found a very comprehensive book online called "Clojure for the Brave and True," but then saw that chapters 2 and 3 are about using Emacs. I figured, "Don't worry about that, I'll just use Light Table." I installed it and noticed that not much had changed. Still, I maintained hope that LT would keep improving and be the awesome Clojure/Clojurescript editor I thought it would become. Needless to say, I'll be reading those Emacs chapters this weekend. :(
- johnwalker 12y ago
  Please see my reply just above yours. You can use vim with clojure too!
  - nazgob 12y ago
    Vim async infrastructure is 'less polished' then emacs. That is why even Vim fans (like me) consider learning emacs for Clojure development.
- aerique 12y ago
  Come on guys, Emacs isn't that hard. You can be productive with it after have gone through the tutorial that comes with it. Like Unix you can't grok all of it (ever), but you won't ever need all of it. Just learn more of it as you go along. See it as a trip :-) And if you need your Emacs Clojure development environment right now, have someone make a VM for you.
  - berdario 12y ago
    > Come on guys, Emacs isn't that hard. You can be productive with it after have gone through the tutorial that comes with it. ...and customized it enough to have an environment comparable to what other editors ship out of the box wc -l ~/.emacs.d/init.el 241 /home/dario/.emacs.d/init.el 241 lines of emacs lisp, and I'm still unsatisfied with the current state of my emacs
    - aerique 12y ago
      ls -l ~/.emacs.d/emacs.org -rw-r--r-- 1 user user 67417 Oct 1 17:01 ~/.emacs.d/emacs.org And after 15 years I'm getting finally somewhat satisfied. However, the alternatives were always worse.
  - muraiki 12y ago
    I should have made note that the reason why I picked vim over emacs for general coding is that I found the various modifier key combinations required to seriously aggravate my RSI (I was unable to complete the tutorial); on the other hand, vim's modal editing has been a huge help. I'm aware of evil mode, so perhaps I'll have to go that route... The ctrl+spacebar and search way that Light Table works, while not the fastest, was still preferable to holding down multiple modifier keys. All that being said, the source of my hand pain might actually have to do with my neck and back, as working on those areas has substantially relieved my pain. So perhaps that will no longer be a barrier to emacs usage in a few months. :)
    - aerique 12y ago
      No, you're right. Emacs default keybindings and especially the longer 'chords' for frequently used commands are horrible. I've never used the defaults[1] for long. First by making my own custom keybindings, then by making keybindings compatible to what most others applications use and a couple of years ago by switching to evil-mode. I already had vi/Vim experience so that was pretty optimal. [1] Except some really basic ones that I also use in the shell: C-a, C-e, C-r, etc.
    - tuhdo 12y ago
johnwalker 12y ago
Hold on now, there are a lot of very stable options. Rich reportedly uses CursiveClojure: https://cursiveclojure.com/ https://cursiveclojure.com/ and there's also vim-fireplace: https://github.com/tpope/vim-fireplace https://github.com/tpope/vim-fireplace By all means, if you don't want to use emacs then you don't have to!
- johnwalker 12y ago
  I retract the statement that Rich uses Cursive. I misinterpreted a tweet a while ago, and hope that I didn't cause too much harm. Instead, I'd like to say that Cursive is extremely nice and that you shouldn't let Emacs scare you away from Clojure.

muraiki 12y ago

I just got back into using Clojure after a bit of a hiatus (and after having learned vim). I found a very comprehensive book online called "Clojure for the Brave and True," but then saw that chapters 2 and 3 are about using Emacs. I figured, "Don't worry about that, I'll just use Light Table." I installed it and noticed that not much had changed. Still, I maintained hope that LT would keep improving and be the awesome Clojure/Clojurescript editor I thought it would become. Needless to say, I'll be reading those Emacs chapters this weekend. :(

johnwalker 12y ago
Please see my reply just above yours. You can use vim with clojure too!
- nazgob 12y ago
  Vim async infrastructure is 'less polished' then emacs. That is why even Vim fans (like me) consider learning emacs for Clojure development.
aerique 12y ago
Come on guys, Emacs isn't that hard. You can be productive with it after have gone through the tutorial that comes with it. Like Unix you can't grok all of it (ever), but you won't ever need all of it. Just learn more of it as you go along. See it as a trip :-) And if you need your Emacs Clojure development environment right now, have someone make a VM for you.
- berdario 12y ago
  > Come on guys, Emacs isn't that hard. You can be productive with it after have gone through the tutorial that comes with it. ...and customized it enough to have an environment comparable to what other editors ship out of the box wc -l ~/.emacs.d/init.el 241 /home/dario/.emacs.d/init.el 241 lines of emacs lisp, and I'm still unsatisfied with the current state of my emacs
  - aerique 12y ago
    ls -l ~/.emacs.d/emacs.org -rw-r--r-- 1 user user 67417 Oct 1 17:01 ~/.emacs.d/emacs.org And after 15 years I'm getting finally somewhat satisfied. However, the alternatives were always worse.
- muraiki 12y ago
  I should have made note that the reason why I picked vim over emacs for general coding is that I found the various modifier key combinations required to seriously aggravate my RSI (I was unable to complete the tutorial); on the other hand, vim's modal editing has been a huge help. I'm aware of evil mode, so perhaps I'll have to go that route... The ctrl+spacebar and search way that Light Table works, while not the fastest, was still preferable to holding down multiple modifier keys. All that being said, the source of my hand pain might actually have to do with my neck and back, as working on those areas has substantially relieved my pain. So perhaps that will no longer be a barrier to emacs usage in a few months. :)
  - aerique 12y ago
    No, you're right. Emacs default keybindings and especially the longer 'chords' for frequently used commands are horrible. I've never used the defaults[1] for long. First by making my own custom keybindings, then by making keybindings compatible to what most others applications use and a couple of years ago by switching to evil-mode. I already had vi/Vim experience so that was pretty optimal. [1] Except some really basic ones that I also use in the shell: C-a, C-e, C-r, etc.
  - tuhdo 12y ago

johnwalker 12y ago

Hold on now, there are a lot of very stable options. Rich reportedly uses CursiveClojure: https://cursiveclojure.com/ https://cursiveclojure.com/ and there's also vim-fireplace: https://github.com/tpope/vim-fireplace https://github.com/tpope/vim-fireplace By all means, if you don't want to use emacs then you don't have to!

johnwalker 12y ago
I retract the statement that Rich uses Cursive. I misinterpreted a tweet a while ago, and hope that I didn't cause too much harm. Instead, I'd like to say that Cursive is extremely nice and that you shouldn't let Emacs scare you away from Clojure.