4 ms·

But that's the thing, it's 2014, it's not working there, it's working on the internet, which is everywhere. Laws need to change to accommodate telecommuting wor

by Mikushi 12y ago

But that's the thing, it's 2014, it's not working there, it's working on the internet, which is everywhere. Laws need to change to accommodate telecommuting workers, no way I would pay my taxes twice.

lucian1900 12y ago
Why would you pay them twice? Pay them once, in the country you actually live in.
- hluska 12y ago
  These are called tax treaties - each individual treaty has some different rules regarding where incomes are earned and where taxes are owning. As an example, here is one between Thailand and Canada: http://www.fin.gc.ca/treaties-conventions/thailand_-eng.asp http://www.fin.gc.ca/treaties-conventions/thailand_-eng.asp
  - nilsimsa 12y ago
    As I understand it, the US is the only country that taxes you on income abroad. So why would there be double taxation elsewhere?
    - gamblor956 12y ago
      More than 2 dozen countries, including China, tax their citizens and permanent residents on their worldwide income. However, as a practical matter only the U.S. actually attempts to enforce its income tax laws on a worldwide basis. The U.S. and China both offer an expatriate exemption (first $100k in income for the US) and foreign tax credits against U.S./China taxes for local country income taxes paid.
vidarh 12y ago
It's not where you work that governments tends to ultimately be concerned about, but whether or not you are consuming local government services, since that's what the taxes are meant to pay for. As a short term tourist, you're a valuable resource. As a long term resident, you may very quickly become a net drain if you pay your tax somewhere else. And for most people, if they live and work in Thailand most of the time, they will either not pay tax in their home country, or will pay tax proportional to the amount of time they live there, on the expectation that someone who is resident outside the country most of the time will not expend much local resources. Laws have dealt with this kind of scenario for a very long time since it's been an issue in border areas pretty much "forever" that people try all kinds of creative methods to cut their tax costs. There's nothing particularly new here with the internet other than magnitude. The biggest notable exception that can cause expensive double taxation is the US, since the IRS likes to get their hands on US citizens income regardless where they live, but even in that case it's ameliorated substantially for most countries via double taxation treaties.
- jaimeyap 12y ago
  This logic is flawed. When does a tourist cross from being profitable to being a drain? The tax argument only holds water if your income is earned in the country you are living in. That money came from a system that is supported by government and shared infrastructure and services. So yes, there is a strong legal and economic argument saying if you earn money from Thailand you should pay taxes in Thailand. The key here being earning money in/from Thailand. But if you are visiting Thailand, but earning money in the US and paying taxes in the US, it's pretty difficult to say that you are a net drain. You absolutely are equivalent economically to a tourist as far as your impact on the economy is concerned. As a non-local citizen, you won't have access to state health care (if it's provided) or anything else tax paying citizens have access to. And your absence from the country would be a net negative value since you will be paying $0 into the local economy instead of room and board, internet connectivity, and general consumption, which all can be taxed with a VAT. Edit: Also, I promise I'm not trying to be an internet jerk :). But I'm not sure what you mean by laws have had to deal with this exact scenario for a long time. They haven't. Generally speaking, the common case is for people to evade taxes by leaving where you earn money and claiming to be a citizen of some other country with more lenient tax laws. Which is the total inverse of this scenario.

by Mikushi 12y ago

lucian1900 12y ago

Why would you pay them twice? Pay them once, in the country you actually live in.

hluska 12y ago
These are called tax treaties - each individual treaty has some different rules regarding where incomes are earned and where taxes are owning. As an example, here is one between Thailand and Canada: http://www.fin.gc.ca/treaties-conventions/thailand_-eng.asp http://www.fin.gc.ca/treaties-conventions/thailand_-eng.asp
- nilsimsa 12y ago
  As I understand it, the US is the only country that taxes you on income abroad. So why would there be double taxation elsewhere?
  - gamblor956 12y ago
    More than 2 dozen countries, including China, tax their citizens and permanent residents on their worldwide income. However, as a practical matter only the U.S. actually attempts to enforce its income tax laws on a worldwide basis. The U.S. and China both offer an expatriate exemption (first $100k in income for the US) and foreign tax credits against U.S./China taxes for local country income taxes paid.

vidarh 12y ago

It's not where you work that governments tends to ultimately be concerned about, but whether or not you are consuming local government services, since that's what the taxes are meant to pay for. As a short term tourist, you're a valuable resource. As a long term resident, you may very quickly become a net drain if you pay your tax somewhere else. And for most people, if they live and work in Thailand most of the time, they will either not pay tax in their home country, or will pay tax proportional to the amount of time they live there, on the expectation that someone who is resident outside the country most of the time will not expend much local resources. Laws have dealt with this kind of scenario for a very long time since it's been an issue in border areas pretty much "forever" that people try all kinds of creative methods to cut their tax costs. There's nothing particularly new here with the internet other than magnitude. The biggest notable exception that can cause expensive double taxation is the US, since the IRS likes to get their hands on US citizens income regardless where they live, but even in that case it's ameliorated substantially for most countries via double taxation treaties.

jaimeyap 12y ago
This logic is flawed. When does a tourist cross from being profitable to being a drain? The tax argument only holds water if your income is earned in the country you are living in. That money came from a system that is supported by government and shared infrastructure and services. So yes, there is a strong legal and economic argument saying if you earn money from Thailand you should pay taxes in Thailand. The key here being earning money in/from Thailand. But if you are visiting Thailand, but earning money in the US and paying taxes in the US, it's pretty difficult to say that you are a net drain. You absolutely are equivalent economically to a tourist as far as your impact on the economy is concerned. As a non-local citizen, you won't have access to state health care (if it's provided) or anything else tax paying citizens have access to. And your absence from the country would be a net negative value since you will be paying $0 into the local economy instead of room and board, internet connectivity, and general consumption, which all can be taxed with a VAT. Edit: Also, I promise I'm not trying to be an internet jerk :). But I'm not sure what you mean by laws have had to deal with this exact scenario for a long time. They haven't. Generally speaking, the common case is for people to evade taxes by leaving where you earn money and claiming to be a citizen of some other country with more lenient tax laws. Which is the total inverse of this scenario.