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Apple boycotts German newspaper after Bentgate Video – open letter to Tim Cook

58 points by jpdus 12y ago

vjvj 12y ago
This is the first bendgate video I've seen and am not surprised that when you bend something that is a long and thin piece of metal it deforms and doesn't return to it's original shape. Like a spoon. What I'm more surprised at is the way Apple dealt with it (if phone call claim is true), for a company that is usually great with PR.
- IBM 12y ago
  This is how Apple PR works. Apple products have so much demand from customers that getting review units is a huge boost to page views. Apple PR has all the leverage and can "punish" publications easily.
  - chc 12y ago
    Given that this appears to have been a legitimately purchased iPhone 6 Plus, I'm not sure what Apple PR could conceivably do to prevent this in the future.
    - IBM 12y ago
      Well in the future they won't be getting review units and will have to wait in line like everyone else to review it. By then the embargo would have been lifted on other publications with review units and they likely won't get nearly as much traffic.
s4sharpie 12y ago
While Apple is known to be less than open in its relationship with the media, this does seem like an overreaction. Probably on both sides. I posit that the local German response of Apple was an overreaction, the magazine's response has probably exacerbated the conflict. It will be interesting to see how this resolves itself.
- chc 12y ago
  Exacerbated the conflict? What else do you imagine Apple is going to do to them?
  - s4sharpie 12y ago
    Quietly retract their German employee's accusations. The open letter is a PR disaster for Apple
imaginenore 12y ago
Apple, that just shows your insecurity.
rayiner 12y ago
So my wife and I went into an Apple store yesterday and tried to bend a 6+. Using a level of pressure no more than what I'd be willing to use for my own Nexus 5, I couldn't even get it to flex. The bigger issue is that it seems designed to fly out of your hand, between the rounded sides and slick aluminum.
- selmnoo 12y ago
  > Using a level of pressure no more than what I'd be willing to use for my own Nexus 5, I couldn't even get it to flex. Of course, using a level of pressure you wouldn't apply to any phone... no-one in their right mind goes around "bending" phones. The thing is, when you have your phone in your pant pocket... and you squat down or something, the arch on your leg is going to easily create upwards of 50+ lbs of pressure at just the right place to create the bend. That's how my co-worker got a bend in his phone. That's right, a guy I personally know got a bend on his iPhone 6. That's why I think the 'only 9 people' line by Apple is absolute and total bull shit. It's infuriating that news journals are just buying it up like it's truth straight from God's lips.
  - GigabyteCoin 12y ago
    >The thing is, when you have your phone in your pant pocket... and you squat down or something, the arch on your leg is going to easily create upwards of 50+ lbs of pressure at just the right place... Agreed. I have bent extremely thick metal keys in my back pocket I assume just by squatting, and I am under 200 pounds in weight. I only noticed because I went to unlock my door one day and the key didn't fit. Thankfully I could hammer it back into place, but unfortunately the same is impossible with an iPhone.
    - rayiner 12y ago
      > I have bent extremely thick metal keys in my back pocket I assume just by squatting, and I am under 200 pounds in weight. But doesn't that just prove it's stupid to put a phablet in your back pocket? There's no hope of making a phone stronger than a thick metal key.
  - 12y ago
deleted 12y ago
[deleted]
hobs 12y ago
Business as usual as far as I am concerned. Apple had super harsh responses to internal folks giving out bumpers to people during the iPhone 4 release, I know more than one guy who got fired for acknowledging the problem to a customer and helping them out before Apple corporate had an official policy.
selmnoo 12y ago
As an aside, the video that really demonstrates how easily iPhone 6+ can bend is this one: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gJ3Ds6uf0Yg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gJ3Ds6uf0Yg Seems to have been bent with considerably small effort, and very quickly.
- eridius 12y ago
  Small effort? According to Consumer Reports, it takes 90 lbs of force to bend an iPhone 6+. That's not small effort. That video just shows the guy was prepared and willing to push as hard as he could. Replace that iPhone 6+ with practically any other modern piece of electronic equipment and he'd probably have damaged that too.
  - bane 12y ago
    He did try another phone, but he couldn't bend it. Was he trying as hard? Meh, dunno. But CR should that 6+ was at least 50% easier to bend than some competition phones.
    - eridius 12y ago
      What other phone did he try? Not all phones take the same pressure. But the iPhone 6+ is hardly the weakest of the lot. Consumer Reports lists it as more durable than the HTC One (90 lbs for deformation of the 6+ vs 70 lbs for the HTC One), and I don't think the HTC One is generally considered to be a flimsy phone (Consumer Reports actually says it's "largely regarded as a sturdy, solid phone").
      - bane 12y ago
        The Moto X.
  - vacri 12y ago
    In another thread on HN, the CR report was taken to task for not applying pressure near the weak point. In this video, the guy does apply pressure there - one of his thumbs is behind the volume buttons where most of the bent photos show a bend. The CR report applies the force in the middle of the phone.
DasIch 12y ago
For those who aren't German and may not know Computerbild or it's publisher. They have about as low a reputation as you can get, so low in fact that sometimes this seems to be the entire goal of what they are doing. Everything they claim should be taken with a huge grain of salt, in fact one should probably assume their claims to be false until proven otherwise.
- eru 12y ago
  For international audiences: ComputerBild is a daughter of Bild, the German equivalent of the Sun.
AaronFriel 12y ago
This is a teachable moment for some managers at Apple in Germany; or as they might be saying to themselves, "Today I Learned about the Streisand Effect." No matter whether or not bendgate is or is not an issue, blacklisting and thumbing your nose at journalists is not a good PR move. I'm surprised people at major corporations keep screwing this up.
- eridius 12y ago
  This isn't the Streisand Effect. Apple isn't censoring anyone. Instead, Apple is doing exactly what that newspaper should have expected them to do: stop giving them test units and event invites. They're not entitled to that stuff, and Apple is under no obligation to invite hostile media to their events. And yes, they are hostile. Consumer Reports proved that the iPhone 6 is not super-sensitive to bending, and in fact the 6+ is even more durable than the 6, and more durable than the HTC One (which Consumer Reports says "is largely regarded as a sturdy, solid phone"). That should have been the end of this whole farce. But the newspaper wanted to jump on the media bandwagon, pretending that the ability to bend a phone is somehow unique to the iPhone, and Apple rightfully decided the newspaper was no longer a business they wanted to work with.
  - pkaye 12y ago
    I believe Consumer Reports should redo with a 4 point bending test to end this controversy once and for all. Then we can compare all products on equal footing.
    - eridius 12y ago
      4 points is not better than 3. If anything, the phone probably withstands more force when you're distributing it over 2 points instead of 1, because those points are (presumably) closer to the edges, and therefore don't have as much leverage.
      - pkaye 12y ago
        3 point loading puts peak moment at one point while 4 point distributes the moment over a wider area to find the weakest point. You can do a simple statics analysis to show this.
ZoFreX 12y ago
> Just to prove that what happens is nothing but the truth. No, it isn't, except in the most myopic and unhelpful way possible. It would be the truth to measure how much force is required and compare it to other phones on the market. It would be the truth to show that almost all phones bend when exposed to that kind of force. It is not "the truth" to show a selective amount of the truth that allows people to keep believing a lie in order to sell papers, and I find it hard to sympathise with fake journalists losing privileges only afforded to legitimate members of the press.
- forgottenpass 12y ago
  You sound a touch too salty to be judging what constitutes "legitimate" press.
  - quchen 12y ago
    To be fair, anything that's German and has "BILD" in its name cries out "tabloid".
    - forgottenpass 12y ago
      Sure, and I'm not trying to defend them, but pulling access over unfavorable coverage isn't the same as never providing it in the first place. We can argue the relative merits of different reasons to distance yourself from a publication, but unfavorable coverage (even unfair coverage) just seems childish and petty.
sxcurry 12y ago
Wow, they were shocked and dismayed? You'd think a newspaper would have had a little more worldly experience. Methinks they are a bit too sensitive.
deleted 12y ago
[deleted]
beenpoor 12y ago
Am I only one who find these videos moronic ? I mean, ofcourse it bends under what appears to be lot of pressure. My take is you shouldn't be affected if you don't wear too tight a jeans to make it bend.
downandout 12y ago
I like Apple products, and I own an iPhone 6 (I also own a 5s, 4, 3gs, 2 iPads, and a Mac). But the level of vitriol directed at anyone even mentioning the obvious problems with the 6 Plus by both Apple and its fanboys is appalling. It only makes the fanboys look even more crazy than they are, and Apple look like it doesn't want to own up to its mistakes. Apple produced an expensive, high profile product with some serious and obvious design flaws. Trying to convince others that the issues don't exist (example - [1]) or vowing revenge against any media outlet that chooses to report on them is just absurd and wouldn't be tolerated in any other PR department. [1] - http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=1792559 http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=1792559
- Terretta 12y ago
  > "Consumer Reports test results find iPhone 6 and 6 Plus not as bendy as believed: All the phones we tested showed themselves to be pretty tough. The iPhone 6 Plus, the more robust of the new iPhones in our testing, started to deform when we reached 90 pounds of force, and came apart with 110 pounds of force. With those numbers, it slightly outperformed the HTC One (which is largely regarded as a sturdy, solid phone), as well as the smaller iPhone 6, yet underperformed some other smart phones." http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/news/2014/09/consumer-reports-tests-iphone-6-bendgate/index.htm http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/news/2014/09/consumer-rep... Consumer Reports is hardly sensational. And they came down on the side of there being a problem with "Antennagate". They didn't think this is a "serious" concern.
  - downandout 12y ago
    I just addressed this in another comment... https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8386068 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8386068
    - boyaka 12y ago
      Consumer reports needs to be called out for misleading people. Its painfully obvious that they were paid off, probably by Apple or their investors, to release this bogus study where they dont even bend it at the weak point, giving ammo to all the fanbois for them to defend against this issue.

58 points by jpdus 12y ago

vjvj 12y ago

This is the first bendgate video I've seen and am not surprised that when you bend something that is a long and thin piece of metal it deforms and doesn't return to it's original shape. Like a spoon. What I'm more surprised at is the way Apple dealt with it (if phone call claim is true), for a company that is usually great with PR.

IBM 12y ago
This is how Apple PR works. Apple products have so much demand from customers that getting review units is a huge boost to page views. Apple PR has all the leverage and can "punish" publications easily.
- chc 12y ago
  Given that this appears to have been a legitimately purchased iPhone 6 Plus, I'm not sure what Apple PR could conceivably do to prevent this in the future.
  - IBM 12y ago
    Well in the future they won't be getting review units and will have to wait in line like everyone else to review it. By then the embargo would have been lifted on other publications with review units and they likely won't get nearly as much traffic.

s4sharpie 12y ago

While Apple is known to be less than open in its relationship with the media, this does seem like an overreaction. Probably on both sides. I posit that the local German response of Apple was an overreaction, the magazine's response has probably exacerbated the conflict. It will be interesting to see how this resolves itself.

chc 12y ago
Exacerbated the conflict? What else do you imagine Apple is going to do to them?
- s4sharpie 12y ago
  Quietly retract their German employee's accusations. The open letter is a PR disaster for Apple

imaginenore 12y ago

Apple, that just shows your insecurity.

rayiner 12y ago

So my wife and I went into an Apple store yesterday and tried to bend a 6+. Using a level of pressure no more than what I'd be willing to use for my own Nexus 5, I couldn't even get it to flex. The bigger issue is that it seems designed to fly out of your hand, between the rounded sides and slick aluminum.

selmnoo 12y ago
> Using a level of pressure no more than what I'd be willing to use for my own Nexus 5, I couldn't even get it to flex. Of course, using a level of pressure you wouldn't apply to any phone... no-one in their right mind goes around "bending" phones. The thing is, when you have your phone in your pant pocket... and you squat down or something, the arch on your leg is going to easily create upwards of 50+ lbs of pressure at just the right place to create the bend. That's how my co-worker got a bend in his phone. That's right, a guy I personally know got a bend on his iPhone 6. That's why I think the 'only 9 people' line by Apple is absolute and total bull shit. It's infuriating that news journals are just buying it up like it's truth straight from God's lips.
- GigabyteCoin 12y ago
  >The thing is, when you have your phone in your pant pocket... and you squat down or something, the arch on your leg is going to easily create upwards of 50+ lbs of pressure at just the right place... Agreed. I have bent extremely thick metal keys in my back pocket I assume just by squatting, and I am under 200 pounds in weight. I only noticed because I went to unlock my door one day and the key didn't fit. Thankfully I could hammer it back into place, but unfortunately the same is impossible with an iPhone.
  - rayiner 12y ago
    > I have bent extremely thick metal keys in my back pocket I assume just by squatting, and I am under 200 pounds in weight. But doesn't that just prove it's stupid to put a phablet in your back pocket? There's no hope of making a phone stronger than a thick metal key.
- 12y ago

deleted 12y ago

[deleted]

hobs 12y ago

Business as usual as far as I am concerned. Apple had super harsh responses to internal folks giving out bumpers to people during the iPhone 4 release, I know more than one guy who got fired for acknowledging the problem to a customer and helping them out before Apple corporate had an official policy.

selmnoo 12y ago

As an aside, the video that really demonstrates how easily iPhone 6+ can bend is this one: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gJ3Ds6uf0Yg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gJ3Ds6uf0Yg Seems to have been bent with considerably small effort, and very quickly.

eridius 12y ago
Small effort? According to Consumer Reports, it takes 90 lbs of force to bend an iPhone 6+. That's not small effort. That video just shows the guy was prepared and willing to push as hard as he could. Replace that iPhone 6+ with practically any other modern piece of electronic equipment and he'd probably have damaged that too.
- bane 12y ago
  He did try another phone, but he couldn't bend it. Was he trying as hard? Meh, dunno. But CR should that 6+ was at least 50% easier to bend than some competition phones.
  - eridius 12y ago
    What other phone did he try? Not all phones take the same pressure. But the iPhone 6+ is hardly the weakest of the lot. Consumer Reports lists it as more durable than the HTC One (90 lbs for deformation of the 6+ vs 70 lbs for the HTC One), and I don't think the HTC One is generally considered to be a flimsy phone (Consumer Reports actually says it's "largely regarded as a sturdy, solid phone").
    - bane 12y ago
      The Moto X.
- vacri 12y ago
  In another thread on HN, the CR report was taken to task for not applying pressure near the weak point. In this video, the guy does apply pressure there - one of his thumbs is behind the volume buttons where most of the bent photos show a bend. The CR report applies the force in the middle of the phone.

DasIch 12y ago

For those who aren't German and may not know Computerbild or it's publisher. They have about as low a reputation as you can get, so low in fact that sometimes this seems to be the entire goal of what they are doing. Everything they claim should be taken with a huge grain of salt, in fact one should probably assume their claims to be false until proven otherwise.

eru 12y ago
For international audiences: ComputerBild is a daughter of Bild, the German equivalent of the Sun.

AaronFriel 12y ago

This is a teachable moment for some managers at Apple in Germany; or as they might be saying to themselves, "Today I Learned about the Streisand Effect." No matter whether or not bendgate is or is not an issue, blacklisting and thumbing your nose at journalists is not a good PR move. I'm surprised people at major corporations keep screwing this up.

eridius 12y ago
This isn't the Streisand Effect. Apple isn't censoring anyone. Instead, Apple is doing exactly what that newspaper should have expected them to do: stop giving them test units and event invites. They're not entitled to that stuff, and Apple is under no obligation to invite hostile media to their events. And yes, they are hostile. Consumer Reports proved that the iPhone 6 is not super-sensitive to bending, and in fact the 6+ is even more durable than the 6, and more durable than the HTC One (which Consumer Reports says "is largely regarded as a sturdy, solid phone"). That should have been the end of this whole farce. But the newspaper wanted to jump on the media bandwagon, pretending that the ability to bend a phone is somehow unique to the iPhone, and Apple rightfully decided the newspaper was no longer a business they wanted to work with.
- pkaye 12y ago
  I believe Consumer Reports should redo with a 4 point bending test to end this controversy once and for all. Then we can compare all products on equal footing.
  - eridius 12y ago
    4 points is not better than 3. If anything, the phone probably withstands more force when you're distributing it over 2 points instead of 1, because those points are (presumably) closer to the edges, and therefore don't have as much leverage.
    - pkaye 12y ago
      3 point loading puts peak moment at one point while 4 point distributes the moment over a wider area to find the weakest point. You can do a simple statics analysis to show this.

ZoFreX 12y ago

> Just to prove that what happens is nothing but the truth. No, it isn't, except in the most myopic and unhelpful way possible. It would be the truth to measure how much force is required and compare it to other phones on the market. It would be the truth to show that almost all phones bend when exposed to that kind of force. It is not "the truth" to show a selective amount of the truth that allows people to keep believing a lie in order to sell papers, and I find it hard to sympathise with fake journalists losing privileges only afforded to legitimate members of the press.

forgottenpass 12y ago
You sound a touch too salty to be judging what constitutes "legitimate" press.
- quchen 12y ago
  To be fair, anything that's German and has "BILD" in its name cries out "tabloid".
  - forgottenpass 12y ago
    Sure, and I'm not trying to defend them, but pulling access over unfavorable coverage isn't the same as never providing it in the first place. We can argue the relative merits of different reasons to distance yourself from a publication, but unfavorable coverage (even unfair coverage) just seems childish and petty.

sxcurry 12y ago

Wow, they were shocked and dismayed? You'd think a newspaper would have had a little more worldly experience. Methinks they are a bit too sensitive.

deleted 12y ago

[deleted]

beenpoor 12y ago

Am I only one who find these videos moronic ? I mean, ofcourse it bends under what appears to be lot of pressure. My take is you shouldn't be affected if you don't wear too tight a jeans to make it bend.

downandout 12y ago

I like Apple products, and I own an iPhone 6 (I also own a 5s, 4, 3gs, 2 iPads, and a Mac). But the level of vitriol directed at anyone even mentioning the obvious problems with the 6 Plus by both Apple and its fanboys is appalling. It only makes the fanboys look even more crazy than they are, and Apple look like it doesn't want to own up to its mistakes. Apple produced an expensive, high profile product with some serious and obvious design flaws. Trying to convince others that the issues don't exist (example - [1]) or vowing revenge against any media outlet that chooses to report on them is just absurd and wouldn't be tolerated in any other PR department. [1] - http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=1792559 http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=1792559

Terretta 12y ago
> "Consumer Reports test results find iPhone 6 and 6 Plus not as bendy as believed: All the phones we tested showed themselves to be pretty tough. The iPhone 6 Plus, the more robust of the new iPhones in our testing, started to deform when we reached 90 pounds of force, and came apart with 110 pounds of force. With those numbers, it slightly outperformed the HTC One (which is largely regarded as a sturdy, solid phone), as well as the smaller iPhone 6, yet underperformed some other smart phones." http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/news/2014/09/consumer-reports-tests-iphone-6-bendgate/index.htm http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/news/2014/09/consumer-rep... Consumer Reports is hardly sensational. And they came down on the side of there being a problem with "Antennagate". They didn't think this is a "serious" concern.
- downandout 12y ago
  I just addressed this in another comment... https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8386068 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8386068
  - boyaka 12y ago
    Consumer reports needs to be called out for misleading people. Its painfully obvious that they were paid off, probably by Apple or their investors, to release this bogus study where they dont even bend it at the weak point, giving ammo to all the fanbois for them to defend against this issue.