19 ms·

If we skip the moral indignation and look at the situation plainly, this sort of technology enables a whole subset of people to actually own cars that were cons

by maratd 12y ago

If we skip the moral indignation and look at the situation plainly, this sort of technology enables a whole subset of people to actually own cars that were considered too risky before. That's a good thing. Given the choice between no car and a car that won't start if I don't pay, I'll go with a gimped car.

pacaro 12y ago
Yeah, if they wanted to be evil, they'd do deals with the gas companies and the further behind your payment is the worse your gas mileage
- Havvy 12y ago
  That'd be illegal under US gov't. regulations.
  - adt2bt 12y ago
    While I think the whole situation is ridiculous (how would you even make a car less gas-efficient on the fly?), consider the many laws broken each day by large companies with the $ to make the suits disappear.
    - aianus 12y ago
      > how would you even make a car less gas-efficient on the fly? My car has a 'sport mode' which seems to do a pretty good job of this ;)
- pandler 12y ago
  I love it. "You can't afford to make payments, so we will make you less able to make payments."
idlewords 12y ago
It also affects a population of buyers who would have been sold an ungimped car before, but will now be sold a gimped car That's not a good thing. How the two factors balance out is not obvious.
- GigabyteCoin 12y ago
  >sold a gimped car You haven't exactly purchased it until all of the payments have been made. Once it's actually yours, I imagine you're free to remove the tracker.
  - munin 12y ago
    you don't own your apartment, but renter laws generally forbid recording and spot inspections by landlords...
    - GigabyteCoin 12y ago
      >forbid recording True. But as for the inspections... In Canada my landlord only need give me 24 hours notice before they enter my apartment whether I agree to it or not. It's not even necessary that I receive and confirm their desire to enter. Simply a note on or under the door 24 hours prior is enough. Even worse... all a landlord must do to enter my apartment without any notice given at any time of day is deem their entrance an emergency. If I owned my apartment and all payments had been made, this could never happen. http://www.ltb.gov.on.ca/en/law/STDPROD_078964.html http://www.ltb.gov.on.ca/en/law/STDPROD_078964.html
shkkmo 12y ago
There are upsides, but it sounds like we need some good old-fashioned consumer protection legislation to protect consumers here. Mandate no location tracking or car shutoff for owners who aren't 30 days past due. Mandate that there be a 24/7 line for emergency car re-activation that is clearly posted in the car. Mandate the provision for 1 non-emergency temporary reactivation to avoid stranding people. The three of those seem like they would go a long way to to assuage people's concerns. EDIT: changed 'two' to 'three' since I apparently can't count...
- golemotron 12y ago
  > There are upsides, but it sounds like we need some good old-fashioned consumer protection legislation to protect consumers here. That's an idea that people have given up on in the US. The only consumer protection legislation I ever hear about is in the EU.
- dperfect 12y ago
  Sounds like stuff that would easily be solved by the market (of course it would be demanded, and of course it would be provided for the right price) if this becomes common practice. No need for legislation. EDIT: Downvote away, but let us remember that having/operating a car is not by any means a basic human right that needs to be protected by legislation. On principle, do you think that if you live across the street from a car rental lot, you should automatically have "emergency" access to any car on the lot at any time? We're talking about essentially renting access to a car that may happen to be parked on your own property, and if you haven't paid for access to the car (or for access to emergency use of the car), then you really don't have any more inherent entitlement to its operation than you do to operating a car parked next door.
  - adt2bt 12y ago
    The negotiating position of people with these devices is already close to nothing. Auto financers can make it a take it or leave it situation, and the consumers often have no choice but to take whatever deal they're given. Especially so if they need a car for work. If you disagree with what I mentioned, I'd love to know why.
vpeters25 12y ago
Here is a plausible case: girl dates cop, he creeps her out so she breaks up with him. Cop harass her at some dark parking lot, she tries to run but can't start her car because cop had the interlock activated on her....
- maxerickson 12y ago
  Why would he abuse his authority in what is likely a traceable way when he could just slash the tires or what not?

by maratd 12y ago

pacaro 12y ago

Yeah, if they wanted to be evil, they'd do deals with the gas companies and the further behind your payment is the worse your gas mileage

Havvy 12y ago
That'd be illegal under US gov't. regulations.
- adt2bt 12y ago
  While I think the whole situation is ridiculous (how would you even make a car less gas-efficient on the fly?), consider the many laws broken each day by large companies with the $ to make the suits disappear.
  - aianus 12y ago
    > how would you even make a car less gas-efficient on the fly? My car has a 'sport mode' which seems to do a pretty good job of this ;)
pandler 12y ago
I love it. "You can't afford to make payments, so we will make you less able to make payments."

idlewords 12y ago

It also affects a population of buyers who would have been sold an ungimped car before, but will now be sold a gimped car That's not a good thing. How the two factors balance out is not obvious.

GigabyteCoin 12y ago
>sold a gimped car You haven't exactly purchased it until all of the payments have been made. Once it's actually yours, I imagine you're free to remove the tracker.
- munin 12y ago
  you don't own your apartment, but renter laws generally forbid recording and spot inspections by landlords...
  - GigabyteCoin 12y ago
    >forbid recording True. But as for the inspections... In Canada my landlord only need give me 24 hours notice before they enter my apartment whether I agree to it or not. It's not even necessary that I receive and confirm their desire to enter. Simply a note on or under the door 24 hours prior is enough. Even worse... all a landlord must do to enter my apartment without any notice given at any time of day is deem their entrance an emergency. If I owned my apartment and all payments had been made, this could never happen. http://www.ltb.gov.on.ca/en/law/STDPROD_078964.html http://www.ltb.gov.on.ca/en/law/STDPROD_078964.html

shkkmo 12y ago

There are upsides, but it sounds like we need some good old-fashioned consumer protection legislation to protect consumers here. Mandate no location tracking or car shutoff for owners who aren't 30 days past due. Mandate that there be a 24/7 line for emergency car re-activation that is clearly posted in the car. Mandate the provision for 1 non-emergency temporary reactivation to avoid stranding people. The three of those seem like they would go a long way to to assuage people's concerns. EDIT: changed 'two' to 'three' since I apparently can't count...

golemotron 12y ago
> There are upsides, but it sounds like we need some good old-fashioned consumer protection legislation to protect consumers here. That's an idea that people have given up on in the US. The only consumer protection legislation I ever hear about is in the EU.
dperfect 12y ago
Sounds like stuff that would easily be solved by the market (of course it would be demanded, and of course it would be provided for the right price) if this becomes common practice. No need for legislation. EDIT: Downvote away, but let us remember that having/operating a car is not by any means a basic human right that needs to be protected by legislation. On principle, do you think that if you live across the street from a car rental lot, you should automatically have "emergency" access to any car on the lot at any time? We're talking about essentially renting access to a car that may happen to be parked on your own property, and if you haven't paid for access to the car (or for access to emergency use of the car), then you really don't have any more inherent entitlement to its operation than you do to operating a car parked next door.
- adt2bt 12y ago
  The negotiating position of people with these devices is already close to nothing. Auto financers can make it a take it or leave it situation, and the consumers often have no choice but to take whatever deal they're given. Especially so if they need a car for work. If you disagree with what I mentioned, I'd love to know why.

vpeters25 12y ago

Here is a plausible case: girl dates cop, he creeps her out so she breaks up with him. Cop harass her at some dark parking lot, she tries to run but can't start her car because cop had the interlock activated on her....

maxerickson 12y ago
Why would he abuse his authority in what is likely a traceable way when he could just slash the tires or what not?