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Hunting the Hunters – Tips for Releasing on Product Hunt

11 points by oo7jeep 12y ago

rrhoover 12y ago
To follow up on #5, talk like a human. People are generally turned off by PR speak so I recommend makers be personable. :)
minimaxir 12y ago
This article fails to mention one of the most popular "tactics" for releasing on Product Hunt: begging your friends for upvotes. In fairness, the OP did not explicitly ask for upvotes on Twitter, just provided a link to his Product Hunt submission. ( https://twitter.com/aten/status/511904562857254914 https://twitter.com/aten/status/511904562857254914 ) The difference is that doing that on Reddit or Hacker News will get your post killed and you potentially shadowbanned. And justifiably so, since putting an emphasis on social media popularity in determining ranking takes away from the quality of the submission. If you don't believe that upvote begging is a problem on Product Hunt, just look at Twitter. ( https://twitter.com/search?q=product%20hunt%20upvote&src=typd https://twitter.com/search?q=product%20hunt%20upvote&src=typ... ) Note how most of those have Favorites and Replies from Ryan Hoover himself or another employee. I doubt this policy will be reversed since it's the reason PH became so popular, but this is the primary reason I'll never take Product Hunt seriously.
- oo7jeep 12y ago
  Not sure I follow. So you are dismissing PH because some people are publicly asking publicly for instead of via gchat, gmail and FB like ppl do for HN?
  - minimaxir 12y ago
    Actually, if you do that on Hacker News, you'll kill the post too. (upvotes from the direct submission URL but not from a HN referrer are not counted.)
- rrhoover 12y ago
  We discourage people from explicitly asking others to upvote their product and you may notice often times product with a high upvote count are actually at the bottom of the page or removed entirely for trying to game the rankings. It's not perfect but we have systems in place to ensure the products featured toward the top, are what the community genuinely thinks is most interesting or useful.
  - alexanderss 12y ago
    That's simply not true. minimaxir just linked to hundreds of Twitter results (as recent as yesterday) of you favoriting and positively commenting on tweets from companies that are explicitly asking for upvotes on their products. I also learned that Product Hunt does this because I've heard/read you specifically mention it in interviews, saying "it grows the site." https://twitter.com/search?q=product%20hunt%20upvote&src=typd https://twitter.com/search?q=product%20hunt%20upvote&src=typ...
    - rrhoover 12y ago
      I favorite to show people I'm listening (read-receipt). It's not an endorsement for asking for upvotes. I realize how this would be misinterpreted so perhaps I'll avoid that in the future.
      - alexanderss 12y ago
        Wait, what? By showing companies "you're listening" to their astroturfing, you are even more actively condoning it. And you ignored this part, but aside from all the tweets and favorites condoning astroturfing, you've said and written that having companies beg users and social networks for upvotes is a growth tactic for Product Hunt. Just come clean when you're called out, man.
        rrhoover 12y ago
        I've never told makers to beg for upvotes and in cases where people have incentivized people (e.g. donating money to charity for every upvote -- yes, that happened), we've removed the post entirely.
- alexanderss 12y ago
  Agreed, I only recently found out how much Product Hunt relies on astroturfing tactics to grow their userbase and promote the site, but whenever I'd check it I was always baffled by what was getting to the top of the "best new products" lists. Their growth hacking and employee "hustling" seem to mess with the quality, so it's just not reliable. I'd actually figured it was organic because top entries still only have about 200 upvotes despite Product Hunt having 50,000 users.

11 points by oo7jeep 12y ago

To follow up on #5, talk like a human. People are generally turned off by PR speak so I recommend makers be personable. :)

minimaxir 12y ago

This article fails to mention one of the most popular "tactics" for releasing on Product Hunt: begging your friends for upvotes. In fairness, the OP did not explicitly ask for upvotes on Twitter, just provided a link to his Product Hunt submission. ( https://twitter.com/aten/status/511904562857254914 https://twitter.com/aten/status/511904562857254914 ) The difference is that doing that on Reddit or Hacker News will get your post killed and you potentially shadowbanned. And justifiably so, since putting an emphasis on social media popularity in determining ranking takes away from the quality of the submission. If you don't believe that upvote begging is a problem on Product Hunt, just look at Twitter. ( https://twitter.com/search?q=product%20hunt%20upvote&src=typd https://twitter.com/search?q=product%20hunt%20upvote&src=typ... ) Note how most of those have Favorites and Replies from Ryan Hoover himself or another employee. I doubt this policy will be reversed since it's the reason PH became so popular, but this is the primary reason I'll never take Product Hunt seriously.

oo7jeep 12y ago
Not sure I follow. So you are dismissing PH because some people are publicly asking publicly for instead of via gchat, gmail and FB like ppl do for HN?
- minimaxir 12y ago
  Actually, if you do that on Hacker News, you'll kill the post too. (upvotes from the direct submission URL but not from a HN referrer are not counted.)
rrhoover 12y ago
We discourage people from explicitly asking others to upvote their product and you may notice often times product with a high upvote count are actually at the bottom of the page or removed entirely for trying to game the rankings. It's not perfect but we have systems in place to ensure the products featured toward the top, are what the community genuinely thinks is most interesting or useful.
- alexanderss 12y ago
  That's simply not true. minimaxir just linked to hundreds of Twitter results (as recent as yesterday) of you favoriting and positively commenting on tweets from companies that are explicitly asking for upvotes on their products. I also learned that Product Hunt does this because I've heard/read you specifically mention it in interviews, saying "it grows the site." https://twitter.com/search?q=product%20hunt%20upvote&src=typd https://twitter.com/search?q=product%20hunt%20upvote&src=typ...
  - rrhoover 12y ago
    I favorite to show people I'm listening (read-receipt). It's not an endorsement for asking for upvotes. I realize how this would be misinterpreted so perhaps I'll avoid that in the future.
    - alexanderss 12y ago
      Wait, what? By showing companies "you're listening" to their astroturfing, you are even more actively condoning it. And you ignored this part, but aside from all the tweets and favorites condoning astroturfing, you've said and written that having companies beg users and social networks for upvotes is a growth tactic for Product Hunt. Just come clean when you're called out, man.
      - rrhoover 12y ago
        I've never told makers to beg for upvotes and in cases where people have incentivized people (e.g. donating money to charity for every upvote -- yes, that happened), we've removed the post entirely.
alexanderss 12y ago
Agreed, I only recently found out how much Product Hunt relies on astroturfing tactics to grow their userbase and promote the site, but whenever I'd check it I was always baffled by what was getting to the top of the "best new products" lists. Their growth hacking and employee "hustling" seem to mess with the quality, so it's just not reliable. I'd actually figured it was organic because top entries still only have about 200 upvotes despite Product Hunt having 50,000 users.