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This is a part of my perspective as a European: The prevailing system of government in the world at present is a mix of socialism, capitalism, welfarism and th
by netcan 12y ago
This is a part of my perspective as a European:
The prevailing system of government in the world at present is a mix of socialism, capitalism, welfarism and the philosophically unchampioned realpolitik practices that were picked up and spread over the years.
In any case, Europe has a philosophical heritage of socialism. It's different flavors at different times in different places. There is also conservatism, capitalist liberalism. All sorts. But socialism is not a bad word in Europe. It's not like flying a swastika. It's part of the political heritage of many parties & people of the political centre.
In any case, I think that socialism including Marx's own writings read in its 1840s political context contain valuable perspectives. That is, you can think of the world as a self organizing playground for heroic, creative individuals as Ayn Rand does. I dig that perspective. You can view the economy as a mechanical ecosystem as many "modern" economists do (including Milton Friedmanesque monetarism, Keynes, and to a lesser extent Austrian School). That's valuable perspective too too, though far less poetic and invigorating.
Back to socialism, it's an important part of our heritage. The history of political, moral and philosophical thought. At the heart of it is class. Class struggle. Class Consciousness. Just thinking about societal dynamics in terms of classes.
The majority of incarcerated Americans are members of certain classes where incarceration is common. Americans, with their allergic reactions to socialist language avoid this construct or paradigm. Instead they think of it as culture, or "socio-economics" a watered down Marxist paradigm without much of the richness.
Prisons, prison complexes and such have always been a class issue. Avoiding this perspective is avoiding the clearest historical perspective of the problem. The whole modern idea of prisons is not that old. People were not incarcerated for decades in the 1600s. Modern prisons, correctional institutions came into being with the industrial age to deal with the class instability of that period. The lowest classes (beneath the working class majority) were prone to crime, drunkenness and generally antisocial lifestyle.
Public sadism solutions (public executions and torture) gave way to forced labour Forced labour gave way to public prisons. These were enabled by Bigger Government (to use an americanism) and a vernal super-sizing of public institution. Along the way, exile (eg Australian & American prison colonies) was tried and some other solutions. But it was always and still is a way of dealing with the underclass problem. Those poor bastards who get the worst of any societal system from Feudalism to Capitalism to Nordic Social Democracy.
Whenever I see American underclass issues bubble to an overflowing boil, from my removed location I see class. I see people growing up in a sector of society with certain norms and expectations. Their part of the economy and the society is mostly defined by class. The encouragement of outliers breaking out of this fate is admirable, but it does not change the realities of class. As people, we continue societies that we are born into for the most part. We also break out and rebel and redefine paradigms. But, classes are sticky. People follow the paths laid out for them from birth.
TLDR: Americans, get over your socialism allergy. Read Marx & Trotsky. Read it in context. Pay attention to the parts about classes in society and their role in history. Discard the bad parts, but read it first before you determine which parts are good and which are bad.
- cousin_it 12y agoDon't attribute the gentleness of European customs to Marxism. Explicitly Marxist countries had the highest incarceration rates in history, because incarceration was used for class warfare with no pretense of "punishing" people for "crimes". I grew up in one of those countries, and I want to weep every time I see a Westerner advising someone to read Marx and Trotsky.
- dragonwriter 12y agoMarxism had a broad impact beyond "explicitly Marxist countries", and all of the latter were actually explicitly Leninist, which, despite claiming continuity with Marx, rejected core elements of Marx's theory of the necessary conditions for socialism and substituted them with top-down paternalistic vanguardism. (This was a general theme, even before Lenin, in Russian "Marxism" -- and certainly includes Trotsky, though.)
- cousin_it 12y agoLet's not overcomplicate things. Marx believed in class struggle and had a favored side in that struggle. That's quite enough. If a government believes in class struggle and has a favored side, it's obvious that atrocities will follow. Same as with a government that believes in a master race.
- Retric 12y agoEvery government picks a side in the class struggle. Saudi America and the USA pick the rich to various degrees. Denmark chooses the lower middle class. Comparing the two it seems like choosing the rich causes far more atrocities their just less visible. Unemployed to long, well sorry we no longer count you. Had your stuff stolen at a homeless shelter well sorry we don't count you. Got picked up for being in the wrong place at the wrong time, well feel free to tell that to the jury. Spending a year in prison awaiting trial, sorry your right to a speedy trial ends well before your actual trial. Prison rape? Sorry just another deterrent. Great you got out after a mere 10 years, best of luck finding a job! PS: Atrocity's are on an absolute scale. Just because country your not as evil as the Khmer Rouge does not make everything ok.