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It was prisoners in camps who build crematoria and operated infrastructure. Soldiers were drafted (involuntary) and would get shot for not following orders. Som
by thrw234902 12y ago
It was prisoners in camps who build crematoria and operated infrastructure. Soldiers were drafted (involuntary) and would get shot for not following orders. Some guards in camp were even Jewish. Nobody pretended anything, they just wanted to live a bit longer.
Just compare it with US prisons or Gaza, everyone is fine with those today.
- coldtea 12y ago>It was prisoners in camps who build crematoria and operated infrastructure. Soldiers were drafted (involuntary) and would get shot for not following orders. If only it was that clear cut. Actually higher personel, as well as guards and soldiers were known to be extremely sadistic, from using women as sex slaves (the "joy divisions"), to cruel games with killing, maiming prisoners for fun, and everything in between. It wasn't just "following orders". There was sadistic enjoyment, and sense of a higher race getting rid of unwanted parasites in lots of these people. That some prisones built crematoria and operated infrastructure (under threat of death) is just a technical detail.
- encoderer 12y agoAlso, the camps themselves were built by businessmen. Hitler had strong ties to German business. He gave many handouts to business over the years, including labor conscription.
- coldtea 12y agoAnother perhaps little known to some fact is that tons of people, especially businessmen and politicians, viewed Hitler favorably in the US, until they entered the war. Including his views on Jews etc. He was a kind of their mascot against "the reds" and against unruly workers and working classes in the US. Also, contrary to some belief, before and even during the war, the US mostly could not care less about the plight of Jews at the time, even when it was known what was happening to them. E.g http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MS_St._Louis http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MS_St._Louis http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_antisemitism_in_the_United_States#The_Holocaust http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_antisemitism_in_the_...
- thrw234902 12y agoI would not call even situation I described 'clear cut', and I think you watched far too many movies.
- coldtea 12y agoNo, I read far too many historical books. Including from actual labour camp survivors, like Primo Levi. Not sure were you got this idea that guards mostly involuntarily and under force did what the did, without active (and sadistic) participation...
- jonyt 12y agoYes, there is absolutely a direct line running from systematically murdering over 11 million innocent people to incarcerating people or killing 2,000 people in a war.
- thrw234902 12y agoLets cut all roads to Manhattan and destroy infrastructure every now and than. I am sure everyone will be just fine after 70 years :-)
- jonyt 12y agoThe Nazis didn't cut roads or destroy infrastructure in the Holocaust, they methodically murdered a lot of people. I really don't see the comparison to the US prison system or to recent events in Gaza.
- thrw234902 12y agoJust follow the thread. My point is that nobody can really blame individuals, who are protecting their ass, for participating on evil. We probably both agree there is something wrong with overblown prison system. But we would hardly blame prison guard for participating. Also we would probably agree to punish prison guard who helps prisoner to escape. Also some innocent civilians died in last Intifada, but nobody is demanding head of soldiers who killed those civilians.
- wsc981 12y agoYou do realize that Hamas uses the infrastructure (schools, hospitals, etc...) for their attacks? It's safer for the IDF to shoot a rocket then perform a land operation.
- fnordfnordfnord 12y agoI'm not fine with them. But, I'll admit that I haven't done anything other than complain about them.