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Relevant XCKD: http://xkcd.com/768/ http://xkcd.com/768/ If TI is such an incumbent, why haven't they been disrupted? Could someone come in and make a better c

Relevant XCKD: http://xkcd.com/768/ http://xkcd.com/768/ If TI is such an incumbent, why haven't they been disrupted? Could someone come in and make a better calculator for a cheaper price (like Casio, in the article. Not sure if it's a better calculator though)? The other problem is, even if they did, no one would buy it because it wouldn't be available for the SAT/ACT. Edit: Casio in the article competes on price.

smeyer 12y ago
I don't think the problem is the SAT/ACT. That's a problem with cellphones, but lots of calculators are allowed on those tests, including the Casios[1]. The bigger challenge seems to be that teachers default to assigning TIs to their students. [1] http://sat.collegeboard.org/register/calculator-policy http://sat.collegeboard.org/register/calculator-policy Five different brands have at least 3 approved graphing calculators for the SATs.
- cdwhite 12y ago
  This is it. In high school statistics, I tried to use my dad's HP-48g, which I dearly loved (in large part thanks to RPL---this was fairly soon after I discovered Scheme and dc). This didn't really work: the teacher would explain how to do something (automated statistical tests, for example) on a TI-89, and I'd have to spend a whole bunch of time trying to figure out the equivalent. This was a pain, and it was compounded by the fact that the HP-48 didn't have the same features as the TI-89, so I was frequently out of luck. The teacher wrote his homeworks and tests with an eye towards what was doable without too much effort on a TI-89, and I imagine that the TI people chose the featureset for the 89 with an eye towards what people would want to do in high school classes, so using anything else was an uphill battle. (We also had occasional homeworks in Excel, and I ran into the same trouble trying to do them in Perl. It didn't help that I was very far from an expert in either Perl or the HP-48g.)
  - gknoy 12y ago
    As a counterpoint, my HS classes used TI-81s, and I had bought a TI-85. Not all the things were in the same place, and so I often had to think of other ways of getting to the same place. At the time I thought it was a good thing, but I'm not sure if it was just that I was geeking out on the nicer hardware. ;)
nathanm412 12y ago
Back in 1998, when I had to buy one, I was given a choice. I could get any of the TI, Casio, or HP options. Most of my classmates got the TI-83, but I chose the TI-89. Mine was much faster and had more memory. I could create better applications. Unfortunately, the teacher taught to the TI-83. Instructions for homework showed what menu options were needed to find the formulas required. It was obvious that if you didn't have the calculator that everyone else has, you might as well not even bring the book to class. You spent more time trying to find the equivalent settings and processes to do the work than actually getting anything done. A competitor would have to include the exact same formulas in the exact same menu locations.
- JoeAltmaier 12y ago
  Isn't that the problem with calculators? The lesson becomes "How to work the calculator" instead of math. I got an HP programmable calculator. It operated on RPN. That makes you think about problems differently, IMHO in a better way. I remember a 'calculator Olympics' involving solving an incredible half-page calculation involving scores of parentheses and transcendental functions. Everybody else launched into typing all that into their TI calculator. I started from the innermost expression (as ALL RPN-trained people do). It was an identity. Hm. As I worked my way out, everything was an identity (sin(90) etc). I got the answer without ever touching a button on my calculator. THAT's what math class should be teaching.

smeyer 12y ago

I don't think the problem is the SAT/ACT. That's a problem with cellphones, but lots of calculators are allowed on those tests, including the Casios[1]. The bigger challenge seems to be that teachers default to assigning TIs to their students. [1] http://sat.collegeboard.org/register/calculator-policy http://sat.collegeboard.org/register/calculator-policy Five different brands have at least 3 approved graphing calculators for the SATs.

cdwhite 12y ago
This is it. In high school statistics, I tried to use my dad's HP-48g, which I dearly loved (in large part thanks to RPL---this was fairly soon after I discovered Scheme and dc). This didn't really work: the teacher would explain how to do something (automated statistical tests, for example) on a TI-89, and I'd have to spend a whole bunch of time trying to figure out the equivalent. This was a pain, and it was compounded by the fact that the HP-48 didn't have the same features as the TI-89, so I was frequently out of luck. The teacher wrote his homeworks and tests with an eye towards what was doable without too much effort on a TI-89, and I imagine that the TI people chose the featureset for the 89 with an eye towards what people would want to do in high school classes, so using anything else was an uphill battle. (We also had occasional homeworks in Excel, and I ran into the same trouble trying to do them in Perl. It didn't help that I was very far from an expert in either Perl or the HP-48g.)
- gknoy 12y ago
  As a counterpoint, my HS classes used TI-81s, and I had bought a TI-85. Not all the things were in the same place, and so I often had to think of other ways of getting to the same place. At the time I thought it was a good thing, but I'm not sure if it was just that I was geeking out on the nicer hardware. ;)

nathanm412 12y ago

Back in 1998, when I had to buy one, I was given a choice. I could get any of the TI, Casio, or HP options. Most of my classmates got the TI-83, but I chose the TI-89. Mine was much faster and had more memory. I could create better applications. Unfortunately, the teacher taught to the TI-83. Instructions for homework showed what menu options were needed to find the formulas required. It was obvious that if you didn't have the calculator that everyone else has, you might as well not even bring the book to class. You spent more time trying to find the equivalent settings and processes to do the work than actually getting anything done. A competitor would have to include the exact same formulas in the exact same menu locations.

JoeAltmaier 12y ago
Isn't that the problem with calculators? The lesson becomes "How to work the calculator" instead of math. I got an HP programmable calculator. It operated on RPN. That makes you think about problems differently, IMHO in a better way. I remember a 'calculator Olympics' involving solving an incredible half-page calculation involving scores of parentheses and transcendental functions. Everybody else launched into typing all that into their TI calculator. I started from the innermost expression (as ALL RPN-trained people do). It was an identity. Hm. As I worked my way out, everything was an identity (sin(90) etc). I got the answer without ever touching a button on my calculator. THAT's what math class should be teaching.