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Thank you for the insights. A quick reply: >Taxi companies are regulated for a variety of reasons Correct. But mostly because they made a mess of their nr1 job:

Thank you for the insights. A quick reply: >Taxi companies are regulated for a variety of reasons Correct. But mostly because they made a mess of their nr1 job: transporting people Today we have new and far better ways t regulate a driver's behavior. Payment in advance, navigation to check the route and a easy way to judge the driver afterwards. That takes care of most of the complaints.

jacquesm 12y ago
But that still leaves the certification of the vehicle, and with the number of kms taxis drive that's not a luxury. Your regular TUV checkups are targeted at regular drivers, not professional drivers. Your insurance company also won't like it if you start ferrying people around on a 150K km/year plan when paying for the statistical chance of getting in an accident based on 40K km/year. In all these cases Uber drivers are using rules and regulations (and statistics) applicable to personal transportation and applying those towards a business.
- digitalengineer 12y ago
  And here we get to the heart of the matter: Individual or group responsibility. Everyone is responsible for their own insurance. Every individual has to communicate an estimate of the miles/km they plan to drive in a year to receive a correct insurance. If you fail to do so, you will loose your insurance. No need to regulate this extra and above the systems already in place. As for yearly or 2-yearly checkups of the car, both are also tied to usage. Most people will drive in and around the city, not accross the country. (This is also why Rand has a place in this discussion promoting the über-individual. I also don't always agree with her conclusions but she did address a lot of concerns of her time, half a century ago).
  - jacquesm 12y ago
    At a guess, insurance companies and passengers alike are not in a position to verify all these issues when they sign up / catch a ride. So some laws were passed and Uber is now ignoring those laws. That private individuals can lie on their application forms and skip certain tests that are required is not a businessmodel.
    - digitalengineer 12y ago
      I really don't think they'll be a Uber driver without the correct papers... And even if they did, they won't be for long.
      - jacquesm 12y ago
        Who will check them?
Xylakant 12y ago
>Taxi companies are regulated for a variety of reasons Correct. But mostly because they made a mess of their nr1 job: transporting people This is not how I feel about it in Germany. Whenever I needed a cab, I got one, for a fair, reasonable price. Might be a little longer if I'm out in the fields or when a thunderstorm hit Berlin and there's no public transport, but sooner or later, I was picked up. Taxis are treated as part of the public transport system here, they have obligations (must transport everyone for the same price, must provide basic service at any time, regulated rates, ...) and in return receive benefits - effectively a monopoly on the taxi market. Now, if we decide to repeal the benefits and allow UberPop, how are we going to make sure we fulfill the obligations? No, surge pricing is not a solution. There's probably a solution, but I'm very much not convinced that Uber is the solution, so until someone presents a genuinely better system, I'll stick with what we have. It's not perfect, but good enough.
- digitalengineer 12y ago
  You make a strong case for the existing taxi-companies. They sure do sound a lot better then Amsterdam taxi's. If they are so loved, I really don't see why they should protest... They will win over client any with their superiour service.
  - Xylakant 12y ago
    They don't protest against Uber as such - they do protest that Uber is skirting the obligations that cost them money and use those savings to undercut their prices. Which is a fair point to make. Uber could easily license their cars as regular taxis and outcompete the regular taxi service. They might even provide better service at the same time - I'm all in favor of that. But they choose not to and then whine about how backwards we all are here that we can't see progress.
- aianus 12y ago
  Is there a law forcing Taxi drivers to go to work during a hurricane or New Year's Eve or something? If not, how is the current system of not being able to find a ride better than Uber's system of making you pay a fair market price for it?

jacquesm 12y ago

But that still leaves the certification of the vehicle, and with the number of kms taxis drive that's not a luxury. Your regular TUV checkups are targeted at regular drivers, not professional drivers. Your insurance company also won't like it if you start ferrying people around on a 150K km/year plan when paying for the statistical chance of getting in an accident based on 40K km/year. In all these cases Uber drivers are using rules and regulations (and statistics) applicable to personal transportation and applying those towards a business.

digitalengineer 12y ago
And here we get to the heart of the matter: Individual or group responsibility. Everyone is responsible for their own insurance. Every individual has to communicate an estimate of the miles/km they plan to drive in a year to receive a correct insurance. If you fail to do so, you will loose your insurance. No need to regulate this extra and above the systems already in place. As for yearly or 2-yearly checkups of the car, both are also tied to usage. Most people will drive in and around the city, not accross the country. (This is also why Rand has a place in this discussion promoting the über-individual. I also don't always agree with her conclusions but she did address a lot of concerns of her time, half a century ago).
- jacquesm 12y ago
  At a guess, insurance companies and passengers alike are not in a position to verify all these issues when they sign up / catch a ride. So some laws were passed and Uber is now ignoring those laws. That private individuals can lie on their application forms and skip certain tests that are required is not a businessmodel.
  - digitalengineer 12y ago
    I really don't think they'll be a Uber driver without the correct papers... And even if they did, they won't be for long.
    - jacquesm 12y ago
      Who will check them?

Xylakant 12y ago

>Taxi companies are regulated for a variety of reasons Correct. But mostly because they made a mess of their nr1 job: transporting people This is not how I feel about it in Germany. Whenever I needed a cab, I got one, for a fair, reasonable price. Might be a little longer if I'm out in the fields or when a thunderstorm hit Berlin and there's no public transport, but sooner or later, I was picked up. Taxis are treated as part of the public transport system here, they have obligations (must transport everyone for the same price, must provide basic service at any time, regulated rates, ...) and in return receive benefits - effectively a monopoly on the taxi market. Now, if we decide to repeal the benefits and allow UberPop, how are we going to make sure we fulfill the obligations? No, surge pricing is not a solution. There's probably a solution, but I'm very much not convinced that Uber is the solution, so until someone presents a genuinely better system, I'll stick with what we have. It's not perfect, but good enough.

digitalengineer 12y ago
You make a strong case for the existing taxi-companies. They sure do sound a lot better then Amsterdam taxi's. If they are so loved, I really don't see why they should protest... They will win over client any with their superiour service.
- Xylakant 12y ago
  They don't protest against Uber as such - they do protest that Uber is skirting the obligations that cost them money and use those savings to undercut their prices. Which is a fair point to make. Uber could easily license their cars as regular taxis and outcompete the regular taxi service. They might even provide better service at the same time - I'm all in favor of that. But they choose not to and then whine about how backwards we all are here that we can't see progress.
aianus 12y ago
Is there a law forcing Taxi drivers to go to work during a hurricane or New Year's Eve or something? If not, how is the current system of not being able to find a ride better than Uber's system of making you pay a fair market price for it?