7 ms·

What I've learned in 30 days since launch (and looking for a cofounder)

103 points by zackattack 17y ago

wvenable 17y ago
"There is a built-in business model here: smart advertising. Artists can pay to have their songs cued up to FOO listeners in exchange for BAZ dollars." Ok, but how do you intend to actually get this advertising money? It's not as simple "if you build it, they will come". You need to be able to sell the site to advertisers. I didn't see anything in your "About me" background that makes you qualified for the "make money" part of this venture. Or you just planning to sell it to someone else to make that happen?
- zackattack 17y ago
  No, I'm planning to charge artists directly in order to promote their songs on the site. I have no plans to sell to advertisers, unless the site gets so popular that I need a sales force to sell ad inventory. Artist can spend 10 hours promoting his songs on twitter, at shows, on myspace, in order to get 50 listeners, or pay $5 to get 100.
- Gibbon 17y ago
  "Artists can pay" is a legal minefield.. lots of potential payola/pay-to-play/bribery issues unless it's made very clear that the artists are paying. Otherwise the more popular you get, the more likely you'll get the FCC crawling down your back. The music industry is one of the most litigious on the planet.. you have to have balls of steel to play in that fishtank. http://www.broadcastlawblog.com/2008/09/articles/internet-radio/payola-on-internet-radio-legal/ http://www.broadcastlawblog.com/2008/09/articles/internet-ra...
  - zaidf 17y ago
    Anyone know the last time a website got in FCC trouble for pay to play?
    - GrandMasterBirt 17y ago
      My co-worker ran radio stations and shows (independent) you have no idea how fucked up they can be! Basically they want metrics on what you play, how much of it for national tracking so they can pay the artists/songwriters/record labels according to some fucked up laws. And you have to have special licenses to play the song online vs on a radio, etc. Its all insane. Basically get really familiar with online-radio broadcasting laws. Also while I'd love to chat about co-founding there is no "about" page were I can at least have an email or number to contact.
      - zackattack 17y ago
        info@hiphopgoblin.com
nobody_nowhere 17y ago
Very cool. Sounds like a Hype Machine for hiphop. My advice: build in reporting/analytics capture into your code early, and solicit user feedback aggressively. Good luck!
- zackattack 17y ago
  Do you have any tips on best ways to solicit user feedback aggessively? As for analytics, do you recommend anything more advanced than simply Google Analytics?
  - nobody_nowhere 17y ago
    Analytics: if GA tells you everything that happens on your site, then you're good to go. I'd want to know # of thumbs up, thumbs down, fast forwards, facebook shares, or any other activity, broken down by user, song, artist, label, geography, browser, time of day, day of week, and where you found the initial song. Why? It's going to help you understand your users, and more importantly, it's the info that people who want to advertise on your site might want. Feedback: This is just me, but I'm too lazy to copy your email address, switch programs/tabs/whatver, paste, type, and send. Give me a form. Click-type-click. Plenty of people might just want to say 'hell yeah' without giving their email address. You can't buy something like that, and it's the kind of thing that will keep you rolling. I'm listening now. This is great. If you want a quick brain dump on online ads I'll send you my email address.
    - zackattack 17y ago
      I would love a quick brain dump on online ads. My email address is info@hiphopgoblin but if you would prefer I can email you first once you give me your address
  - auston 17y ago
    Not really analytics... but userfly is killer: http://userfly.com http://userfly.com
    - 17y ago
revorad 17y ago
Awesome dude! Instead of making hollow claims of doing something in a weekend, you have actually built a site up to 180 uniques/day within a month? Respect.
- zackattack 17y ago
  I built it part-time in a week, and then it immediately went to 180 uniques/day. But without (minimal) hands-on involvement traffic has decreased to ~55 uniques/day. The prospect of throwing out all the code and the redoing v2 myself is just psychologically daunting. In looking for a cofounder, I'm mostly seeking social support and motivation (as well as someone a little more technically experienced to complement me)
  - jmtame 17y ago
    feel free to also check out hndir.com if you're looking for co-founders. everyone there is a verified undergrad in a particular school.
    - zackattack 17y ago
      error: our sendmail is fubar. please e-mail jtame2@illinois.edu.
      - joshhart 17y ago
        Same here. Would you mind adding alumni support & status? I'd like to register but I just graduated.
        deleted 17y ago
        [deleted]
movix 17y ago
I liked this when you launched it here recently. I still don't understand how you're dealing with the PRS issues though. At some point, someone has to pay the artists. Can you give any insights on how you deal with this? Best of luck with a great app.
- zackattack 17y ago
  I am making a shift to artist-uploads only. It turns out that most of the popular songs on hiphopgoblin v1 are actually songs by less-known artists. There is a high demand for better upload/management features so that's what I'm building. Conveniently, when they upload the songs the artists themselves can agree to give me rights to play their music. Nice it works out this way.
  - redorb 17y ago
    sounds like a - 'no name artist' pandora ; which isn't bad; but to advertise over/around their songs might require special agreements...with artist and/or labels if they ever sign. Good luck with your idea, I hope it works out well for you.
  - Gibbon 17y ago
    If any of the musicians are ASCAP members, then you're going to need an ASCAP licence and you'll have to pay performance royalties unless you get legal agreements with all the artists to waive their royalties as a part of your fees. There's also the whole copyright infringement issue and users uploading material they don't have the rights to. You'll need to monitor uploads constantly.
zaidf 17y ago
Hey, since you said you are a big fan of Eric Reis/Blank, I had to ask you if you are doing the customer development survey(http://survey.io http://survey.io)? More here: http://startup-marketing.com/free-customer-development-help-surveyio/ http://startup-marketing.com/free-customer-development-help-...
maxklein 17y ago
Nice site, good idea. Fix your design for cheap by asking designers on rent a coder to make you a psd.
bittersweet 17y ago
I'm not trying to plug my own stuff, but just wanted to tell you I've been busy doing something like this a while back as well :) You can check it out here (Dutch) http://www.denachtdienst.org/ http://www.denachtdienst.org/ or an artist page http://www.denachtdienst.org/users/freddie-flinkstoned http://www.denachtdienst.org/users/freddie-flinkstoned Source is available as well at http://github.com/bittersweet/denachtdienst.org http://github.com/bittersweet/denachtdienst.org Let me know if you want to talk about it or if you want to borrow/steal something ;-)

103 points by zackattack 17y ago

"There is a built-in business model here: smart advertising. Artists can pay to have their songs cued up to FOO listeners in exchange for BAZ dollars." Ok, but how do you intend to actually get this advertising money? It's not as simple "if you build it, they will come". You need to be able to sell the site to advertisers. I didn't see anything in your "About me" background that makes you qualified for the "make money" part of this venture. Or you just planning to sell it to someone else to make that happen?

zackattack 17y ago
No, I'm planning to charge artists directly in order to promote their songs on the site. I have no plans to sell to advertisers, unless the site gets so popular that I need a sales force to sell ad inventory. Artist can spend 10 hours promoting his songs on twitter, at shows, on myspace, in order to get 50 listeners, or pay $5 to get 100.
Gibbon 17y ago
"Artists can pay" is a legal minefield.. lots of potential payola/pay-to-play/bribery issues unless it's made very clear that the artists are paying. Otherwise the more popular you get, the more likely you'll get the FCC crawling down your back. The music industry is one of the most litigious on the planet.. you have to have balls of steel to play in that fishtank. http://www.broadcastlawblog.com/2008/09/articles/internet-radio/payola-on-internet-radio-legal/ http://www.broadcastlawblog.com/2008/09/articles/internet-ra...
- zaidf 17y ago
  Anyone know the last time a website got in FCC trouble for pay to play?
  - GrandMasterBirt 17y ago
    My co-worker ran radio stations and shows (independent) you have no idea how fucked up they can be! Basically they want metrics on what you play, how much of it for national tracking so they can pay the artists/songwriters/record labels according to some fucked up laws. And you have to have special licenses to play the song online vs on a radio, etc. Its all insane. Basically get really familiar with online-radio broadcasting laws. Also while I'd love to chat about co-founding there is no "about" page were I can at least have an email or number to contact.
    - zackattack 17y ago
      info@hiphopgoblin.com

nobody_nowhere 17y ago

Very cool. Sounds like a Hype Machine for hiphop. My advice: build in reporting/analytics capture into your code early, and solicit user feedback aggressively. Good luck!

zackattack 17y ago
Do you have any tips on best ways to solicit user feedback aggessively? As for analytics, do you recommend anything more advanced than simply Google Analytics?
- nobody_nowhere 17y ago
  Analytics: if GA tells you everything that happens on your site, then you're good to go. I'd want to know # of thumbs up, thumbs down, fast forwards, facebook shares, or any other activity, broken down by user, song, artist, label, geography, browser, time of day, day of week, and where you found the initial song. Why? It's going to help you understand your users, and more importantly, it's the info that people who want to advertise on your site might want. Feedback: This is just me, but I'm too lazy to copy your email address, switch programs/tabs/whatver, paste, type, and send. Give me a form. Click-type-click. Plenty of people might just want to say 'hell yeah' without giving their email address. You can't buy something like that, and it's the kind of thing that will keep you rolling. I'm listening now. This is great. If you want a quick brain dump on online ads I'll send you my email address.
  - zackattack 17y ago
    I would love a quick brain dump on online ads. My email address is info@hiphopgoblin but if you would prefer I can email you first once you give me your address
- auston 17y ago
  Not really analytics... but userfly is killer: http://userfly.com http://userfly.com
  - 17y ago

revorad 17y ago

Awesome dude! Instead of making hollow claims of doing something in a weekend, you have actually built a site up to 180 uniques/day within a month? Respect.

zackattack 17y ago
I built it part-time in a week, and then it immediately went to 180 uniques/day. But without (minimal) hands-on involvement traffic has decreased to ~55 uniques/day. The prospect of throwing out all the code and the redoing v2 myself is just psychologically daunting. In looking for a cofounder, I'm mostly seeking social support and motivation (as well as someone a little more technically experienced to complement me)
- jmtame 17y ago
  feel free to also check out hndir.com if you're looking for co-founders. everyone there is a verified undergrad in a particular school.
  - zackattack 17y ago
    error: our sendmail is fubar. please e-mail jtame2@illinois.edu.
    - joshhart 17y ago
      Same here. Would you mind adding alumni support & status? I'd like to register but I just graduated.
      - deleted 17y ago
        [deleted]

movix 17y ago

I liked this when you launched it here recently. I still don't understand how you're dealing with the PRS issues though. At some point, someone has to pay the artists. Can you give any insights on how you deal with this? Best of luck with a great app.

zackattack 17y ago
I am making a shift to artist-uploads only. It turns out that most of the popular songs on hiphopgoblin v1 are actually songs by less-known artists. There is a high demand for better upload/management features so that's what I'm building. Conveniently, when they upload the songs the artists themselves can agree to give me rights to play their music. Nice it works out this way.
- redorb 17y ago
  sounds like a - 'no name artist' pandora ; which isn't bad; but to advertise over/around their songs might require special agreements...with artist and/or labels if they ever sign. Good luck with your idea, I hope it works out well for you.
- Gibbon 17y ago
  If any of the musicians are ASCAP members, then you're going to need an ASCAP licence and you'll have to pay performance royalties unless you get legal agreements with all the artists to waive their royalties as a part of your fees. There's also the whole copyright infringement issue and users uploading material they don't have the rights to. You'll need to monitor uploads constantly.

zaidf 17y ago

Hey, since you said you are a big fan of Eric Reis/Blank, I had to ask you if you are doing the customer development survey(http://survey.io http://survey.io)? More here: http://startup-marketing.com/free-customer-development-help-surveyio/ http://startup-marketing.com/free-customer-development-help-...

maxklein 17y ago

Nice site, good idea. Fix your design for cheap by asking designers on rent a coder to make you a psd.

bittersweet 17y ago

I'm not trying to plug my own stuff, but just wanted to tell you I've been busy doing something like this a while back as well :) You can check it out here (Dutch) http://www.denachtdienst.org/ http://www.denachtdienst.org/ or an artist page http://www.denachtdienst.org/users/freddie-flinkstoned http://www.denachtdienst.org/users/freddie-flinkstoned Source is available as well at http://github.com/bittersweet/denachtdienst.org http://github.com/bittersweet/denachtdienst.org Let me know if you want to talk about it or if you want to borrow/steal something ;-)