4 ms·

How Netflix came to pay Comcast for Internet traffic

45 points by sorenbs 12y ago

eck 12y ago
As a customer of both Netflix and an ISP that participates in Open Connect, I'm slightly annoyed that Netflix didn't turn around and immediately pass this charge on to their users that connect from Comcast. Why should I have to subsidize that? I wonder if their agreement forbids that.
- sorenbs 12y ago
  My thought exactly. Alternatively you should demand that your ISP go charge Netflix and reduce your bill accordingly.
- frandroid 12y ago
  Because this would enable Comcast to then increase what fees it charges Netflix, higher and higher, until either Netflix says "that's enough", and don't pass on that increase, or Netflix starts losing customers to say, a cheaper competitor that Comcast prefers because it owns (part of) it. Better stop these games at the door. Most Comcast customers don't have a choice of provider anyway, so it's not like they can choose a different ISP to connect to Netflix. You don't want to penalize customers stuck buying from a monopoly. Other customers paying $8/month to get this amazing Netflix service and are "forced" to "subsidize" Comcast customers, that won't elicit much tears from me. :P
  - r00fus 12y ago
    That cheaper competitor by Comcast already exists: http://www.comcast.com/streampix http://www.comcast.com/streampix
    - frandroid 12y ago
      Oh dear. Thanks for the link. Hello anti-trust. Hollywood Studios were split up once for this. while history { history = true }
RexRollman 12y ago
What I don't understand is: if I am paying Comcast and Netflix is paying Comcast, then why does Netflix traffic count against me? Comcast is already getting paid twice!
- sliverstorm 12y ago
  Comcast is already getting paid twice! Number of payments by itself is hardly meaningful... Have you never received a parcel with insufficient postage, and been asked to pay the remainder (else it be returned to sender)? How evil of the postal service, demanding to be paid twice (nevermind that they weren't paid in full the first time)!
  - dubcanada 12y ago
    You seem to be implying that people who have comcast are either not paying their bill or not paying enough. That seems to be more of a comcast issue.
  - FfejL 12y ago
    No, Its as if the Post Office agreed to delivery my mail at .43 a letter, but then asked me for more money when my Mom started send me 10 letters a day with the proper postage. I (and millions of others) pay Comcast a certain rate for a certain data plan. In my case, about $50/month for 50Mb down, 2Mb up, capped at 250GB per month. So if I want to watch 250G of movies in a month, at those data rates, why should I or anyone else have to pay more? I've already contracted with Comcast for that much bandwidth. The reality, of course, is that Comcast (and all other ISPs) MASSIVELY oversubscribe their own network. They don't have any where near the capacity to actually support what they sell. And they want Netflix to foot the bill for the buildout required to provide the capacity they claim they sold me.
  - click170 12y ago
    I don't think this is a fair analogy. You don't pay the post office a flat fee for the ability to receive all packages, but from my perspective that's exactly what I pay my ISP for. Granted you do pay the post office in the form of taxes, but IMO that situation is different enough to make for a very poor analogy.
pzxc 12y ago
I didn't know that Netflix is now also paying AT&T, Verizon, and TWCable too!
thegenius 12y ago
This article assumes readers will have the background to understand all the jibberish it presents. Meanwhile, it does't paint anything close to a clear picture on the inside scoop of "How Netflix cam to pay Comcast for Internet traffic". That makes the article damn near worthless IMO
- yonran 12y ago
  Perhaps the blog excerpted too little of the petition (it started at page 55, or PDF page 63). I recommend starting at section V.C on page 52, or PDF page 60 instead. I think the description of Comcast’s actions since 2009 paints a pretty damning picture of Comcast’s abuse of its monopoly on high-speed last-mile wire in many parts of the US. Or, read the entire petition, which is a good read; it’s 100 double-spaced pages. The PDF also includes other evidence: 22 pages of statement from Ken Florance, VP of Content Delivery (PDF page 110) and 100 pages from economist David Evans (PDF page 134).
jeremycw 12y ago
I wouldn't mind this if I knew that the money was actually going toward upgrading infrastructure and not just lining Comcast's pockets.

45 points by sorenbs 12y ago

eck 12y ago

As a customer of both Netflix and an ISP that participates in Open Connect, I'm slightly annoyed that Netflix didn't turn around and immediately pass this charge on to their users that connect from Comcast. Why should I have to subsidize that? I wonder if their agreement forbids that.

sorenbs 12y ago
My thought exactly. Alternatively you should demand that your ISP go charge Netflix and reduce your bill accordingly.
frandroid 12y ago
Because this would enable Comcast to then increase what fees it charges Netflix, higher and higher, until either Netflix says "that's enough", and don't pass on that increase, or Netflix starts losing customers to say, a cheaper competitor that Comcast prefers because it owns (part of) it. Better stop these games at the door. Most Comcast customers don't have a choice of provider anyway, so it's not like they can choose a different ISP to connect to Netflix. You don't want to penalize customers stuck buying from a monopoly. Other customers paying $8/month to get this amazing Netflix service and are "forced" to "subsidize" Comcast customers, that won't elicit much tears from me. :P
- r00fus 12y ago
  That cheaper competitor by Comcast already exists: http://www.comcast.com/streampix http://www.comcast.com/streampix
  - frandroid 12y ago
    Oh dear. Thanks for the link. Hello anti-trust. Hollywood Studios were split up once for this. while history { history = true }

RexRollman 12y ago

What I don't understand is: if I am paying Comcast and Netflix is paying Comcast, then why does Netflix traffic count against me? Comcast is already getting paid twice!

sliverstorm 12y ago
Comcast is already getting paid twice! Number of payments by itself is hardly meaningful... Have you never received a parcel with insufficient postage, and been asked to pay the remainder (else it be returned to sender)? How evil of the postal service, demanding to be paid twice (nevermind that they weren't paid in full the first time)!
- dubcanada 12y ago
  You seem to be implying that people who have comcast are either not paying their bill or not paying enough. That seems to be more of a comcast issue.
- FfejL 12y ago
  No, Its as if the Post Office agreed to delivery my mail at .43 a letter, but then asked me for more money when my Mom started send me 10 letters a day with the proper postage. I (and millions of others) pay Comcast a certain rate for a certain data plan. In my case, about $50/month for 50Mb down, 2Mb up, capped at 250GB per month. So if I want to watch 250G of movies in a month, at those data rates, why should I or anyone else have to pay more? I've already contracted with Comcast for that much bandwidth. The reality, of course, is that Comcast (and all other ISPs) MASSIVELY oversubscribe their own network. They don't have any where near the capacity to actually support what they sell. And they want Netflix to foot the bill for the buildout required to provide the capacity they claim they sold me.
- click170 12y ago
  I don't think this is a fair analogy. You don't pay the post office a flat fee for the ability to receive all packages, but from my perspective that's exactly what I pay my ISP for. Granted you do pay the post office in the form of taxes, but IMO that situation is different enough to make for a very poor analogy.

pzxc 12y ago

I didn't know that Netflix is now also paying AT&T, Verizon, and TWCable too!

thegenius 12y ago

This article assumes readers will have the background to understand all the jibberish it presents. Meanwhile, it does't paint anything close to a clear picture on the inside scoop of "How Netflix cam to pay Comcast for Internet traffic". That makes the article damn near worthless IMO

yonran 12y ago
Perhaps the blog excerpted too little of the petition (it started at page 55, or PDF page 63). I recommend starting at section V.C on page 52, or PDF page 60 instead. I think the description of Comcast’s actions since 2009 paints a pretty damning picture of Comcast’s abuse of its monopoly on high-speed last-mile wire in many parts of the US. Or, read the entire petition, which is a good read; it’s 100 double-spaced pages. The PDF also includes other evidence: 22 pages of statement from Ken Florance, VP of Content Delivery (PDF page 110) and 100 pages from economist David Evans (PDF page 134).

jeremycw 12y ago

I wouldn't mind this if I knew that the money was actually going toward upgrading infrastructure and not just lining Comcast's pockets.